I use a Stop Sign intersection at peak time where I am always turning right, yet most of the other drivers that use it are approaching directly opposite me and, after stopping, are mostly driving straight ahead through. My question is why do so many right turning drivers not turn and go straight after the "right of way" car has passed ? The following opposite car (usually also driving straight through after the previous one) is still to pull up to the line, and is required to stop, so there is often enough time to go, yet people wait for sometimes all of the 5 or more "straight ahead" cars to all pull up, stop, go - repeat. I note the road code mentions about right turning traffic giving way, but think it should also mention that it "refers to giving way to right-of-way cars which have already stopped and awaiting clear path themselves" Have others noticed how frustrating it is to be waiting behind someone at a busy intersection in this same way ?
saxman99,
Sep 11, 2:56am
Well, I drive a BMW so I don't really worry about such trivia as stopping, giving way, indicating etc. It just slows me down.
pauldw,
Sep 11, 3:00am
If any of the opposite cars can see all other vehicles from where they have stopped they don't have to stop again after moving up a short distance. Don't be to quick to turn you might get hit by the 2nd car.
2sheddies,
Sep 11, 3:00am
I still think it's probably safer to wait. You never know what the next car will do. You can't just assume he'll pull up and stop, giving you time to turn. If he coasts up to the line, has a quick look (or doesn't bother to look) and shoots out without coming to the required compulsory stop as so many do every day at stop signs all over the country, and there you are in the middle of your turn. whoops.
2sheddies,
Sep 11, 3:03am
Yes they DO have to stop again! It's not optional. it's a compulsory stop. It makes no difference whether or not you can see the road is clear.
Unfortunately, as I said above, hundreds and hundreds of steerers don't understand what stop means, and seem to treat it as a give way.
eagles9999,
Sep 11, 3:04am
EXACTLY
gman35,
Sep 11, 3:10am
Yes , in the case of this intersection there is a high fence right up by the corner so they would not be able to see until up nearer the white line at least. To all those which (rightly) advise it would be safer to just give way, if I am however not putting a passenger at risk though, "the other" car would surely legally be in the wrong if they had not stopped. (Yes I know I would have to prove it somehow).
tintop,
Sep 11, 3:11am
Yep - in Warkworth traffic signs are seen as a guide to foreigners. not something to take any notice of in normal practice.
tintop,
Sep 11, 3:15am
Correct to a point. The key ingredient is that drivers must stop in a position that they can see that the road is clear. This can be behind the line or over the line. The line is there as an additional indicator that the intersection is controlled by a compulsory stop . (The Crown Vs Tintop, Gisborne District Court, Dec 1965 )
On gravel roads the yellow line is not a requirement.
2sheddies,
Sep 11, 3:15am
Something of a problem in all other areas too I'd imagine. There were one or two interesting intersections up there. have they sorted that SH1 Hill Street shambles out yet? Been a few years since I was last there.
tintop,
Sep 11, 3:18am
Yep - that one is a cracker. I have the right of way in my farm ute, but not in the new car!.
2sheddies,
Sep 11, 3:20am
I was pondering that. if you got tangled up in the middle of the intersection, is it your fault for jumping the gun, or theirs for not stopping? I suspect at a guess, you'd maybe get the blame, as it might be hard to prove they didn't completely stop, whereas they'd say you should've waited until the way was fully clear.
tintop,
Sep 11, 3:24am
I assume that a second car will take off as soon at the first, if it has actually stopped behind the first. But if the second car is still travelling towards the stop, and has not actually yet stopped, I do my right turn.
loose.unit8,
Sep 11, 3:29am
Isn't the point that they've already stopped. As long as they were in a position to see if the road was clear or not, why they should stop again? The road code simply says "stop where you can see vehicles coming from all directions" and the legislation is similarly vague -
Land Transport (Road User) Rule 2004 Part 4 Stopping and giving way 4.1Giving way where vehicles are controlled by stop sign or give-way sign (1)A driver approaching or entering an intersection on a roadway where the vehicles that are moving in the direction in which that driver is travelling are controlled by a stop sign at or near the intersection must??
2sheddies,
Sep 11, 3:30am
Haha love it! That flaming thing was a disaster some days. I often used to turn off, go through the village and come back out Whittaker Rd if going south. was often quicker!
2sheddies,
Sep 11, 3:32am
That would work, provided you gave that farm ute the appropriate amount of jandal. but if in the new car, you should wait!
gman35,
Sep 11, 3:33am
That is what I do also, but why is there no reference to this exact point in the road code? As theoretically you could be waiting all day while the straight through traffic that arrives at the intersection ages after you, gets the right of way all the time.
gman35,
Sep 11, 3:39am
Yep, have read it but still confused as to the exact right of way before the oncoming car at a "Stop" compared to a "Giveway". Am I having a mindblank or does it cover my point somewhere ?
2sheddies,
Sep 11, 3:59am
My understanding has always been you must stop at the the line, or wherever you can see clearly when it's your turn to go next. (So if there was some obstruction, like a truck parked on the corner for example, you can pull forward of the line) But you can't be three cars back and able to see it's clear, and so just pull out when it's your turn. You still must do your compulsory stop when you arrive at the head of the queue.
gman35,
Sep 11, 4:08am
As I thought would be the correct thing, which gives the right turning car an opportunity to turn just after a straight-ahead vehicle. (Admittedly it does need to be "just after", before the next straight-ahead car can stop and go !).
tamarillo,
Sep 11, 4:18am
That's good to know, thanks
tamarillo,
Sep 11, 4:21am
Back to op post. Seems to me that with courtesy you could turn quickly after a car goes straight, and hardly slow the next car if at all. But it might not always work as courtesy isn't a strong point of NZ drivers. So depends on what you drive!
2sheddies,
Sep 11, 4:23am
Yep, I see exactly what you mean. If everyone understood that stop meant stop, and the car doing the turn got on with it and didn't dawdle about, your idea would work very well. But the unfortunate reality is, we can't assume the other muppet will do what they're supposed to, which is why I said in the first post it might be better to wait. frustrating though it may be, the alternative might be an insurance claim and a car off the road for days/weeks. Or worse.
gman35,
Sep 11, 4:23am
So have I missed something in the actual road rule wording that allows right turners to do this or am I "legally" stuck there 'til peak traffic eases ?
melonhead1,
Sep 11, 4:34am
Go straight ahead at the stop sign, turn into a driveway, reverse out and turn left at the other way to go where you want to go.
Since the public registrations are closed, you must have an invite from a current member to be able to register and post in this thread.
Have an account? Login here.