Now my project car has been on the go for just over 8 years and main roll hoop sizing regulations have changed, does paperwork submitted years ago (not the formal application, just provisional, and OKayed) mean that the cage will stil get passed, or do we do the usual thing and rip the total front cage out if it doesn't, given that a simple main hoop with back stays doesn't need approval!Trying to replace a main hoop now the car is painted and trimmed is not a task that appeals, especially when it is not a full race car.
If anyone else has gone through it recently and had one passed I'd like to know, as my car isn't far from mechanical completion.Still a bit of fibreglass panel work to finish - and the total front suspension to be rebuilt to conform to current regs. Cage has to be passed before the car can be certified.
kcf,
Sep 24, 12:04pm
Sorry I don't know this one socram, as I've not worked there for a few years, so I'm not up with the play as far as cars that were approved prior to the main hoop size changing.Best plan, give Julian / Mike a ring and they will be able to answer that one for you :-)
roberto9,
Sep 24, 2:47pm
I'm not sure on this one, my gut feeling is if it was not fully homoligated at the time you are back to square one. How ever, I am attending a MSNZ scrutineering training session tonight, so will ask and report back tomorrow.
socram,
Sep 24, 7:02pm
Thanks for that.Cage is one of the first things to be done in any project and I wouldn't be the first to have taken many years to get to this stage.Any changes to regs part way through any project are of dubious value, simply because the levels of build and safety are already massively advanced from the 1960's so now the law of diminishing returns applies.
Bunnings have run out of the fire extinguishers that comply with the new rules (two metal retaining straps now required rather than one).Would love to know how many single retainers let go!
rod-zone,
Sep 24, 8:29pm
Are you talking M.A.N.Z ruling or NZHRA/NZDRA! there is a difference,the rule change only applies to M.A.N.Z as ive just been through this issue with a car at work Gav
roberto9,
Sep 25, 2:57am
what a way to start a new day. Not particularly good news. The blunt answer seems to be, rip it out and start again. However, I have had aquick look at " the book" NZMS Manual no.35, and there may be some other options. Now I dont know what type of car you have or what events you are likely to do, from what you mention above I conclude it will be road going and legal for that. If that is correct, have a look at the chart on page 258, you might find a fit there. Failing that check out page 310, art 5.7. alternative design. Even though yoursis already built, you could find out how much an approved certifying engineer would whack you for the calcs and compare that to the cost of a rebuild. Other than these suggestions I have no definite solution. On the fire extinguisher subject. Mitre 10 stock them down this way. They now have a 6 year life span,(the extinguisher, not Mitre10) so that is one thing you can safely leave 'til the last minute, and yes there have been occaisions where the single strap has failed, mainly due to operator error, in not closing them properly, but don't ask to many questions about that or they may want 2 locking devices on your harness.
pollymay,
Sep 25, 3:10am
Mine did once, bounced off the dash and all around the car like a missle. Didn't break anything though luckily.
twink19,
Sep 25, 4:31am
I did an inspection on one earlier this year and they passed it, it had been built about 3 years ago, we were told last year that the changes were going to happen, should have put the paper work in sooner
socram,
Sep 25, 7:21am
Provisional paperwork and photographs were submitted years ago and before painting etc., as per the MSNZ rules and provisionally approved. Yes, It is only a road car and cage design was to MSNZ approved designs and built by an approved cage builder.There is no way I would rip it all out and start again, but as stated earlier, rather than replace the main hoop, I'd just remove the front part of the cage and leave the main hoop and back stays.A classic case of removing safety items to make the car less safe but to bring it within the rules. I just wish MSNZ/FIA or whoever, would differentiate between out and out race cars and relatively slow road cars, where the cage is optional anyway and is more for peace of mind than anything else. A properly built cage to the previous rules is so marginally less safe than a new one with a thicker hoop that it is almost immeasurable in terms of the overall risk calculations, and I do mean overall, not just the mechanical and physical risk. Sure a six point harness is better than a 5 point, a 5 better than a 4, a four point better than a 3 and a 3 point better than a lap strap, but a lap strap only is still 80% better than no strap at all.Same thinking applies to cages or roll protection. Thanks roberto.A call to MSNZ is in order I think, before I lodge the formal paperwork. For any prospective road/racer, buy a car that has the cage and paperwork in place, it is much easier than building your own.
socram,
Sep 25, 11:37am
Great.The whole MSNZ technical team is on the road until next Monday!.
splinter67,
Sep 25, 11:42am
Go have cold one it looks like you need one. If I was you Id be bald by now and my posts would have lots of swearing in them
kcf,
Sep 25, 12:03pm
So give one of them a ring on cellphone :-)
jerichord,
Sep 25, 1:47pm
aah socram, do think that morris will go fast enough to require a roll cage.
socram,
Sep 25, 2:35pm
Sent them all an email. They are busy doing Scrutineer training as mentioned by earlier poster. Jerichord - lets wait and see!Should be fun though with 4 wheel discs and a suspension that should now work well, 3500cc instead of 1500cc.
sr2,
Sep 25, 2:36pm
Ask Andy from Race FX at Hampton Downs, he's allways helpfull and has more experience than most.
skydog,
Sep 25, 2:53pm
Hi Socramhad a cage fitted to my Mr2 just as the rules changedThe foot plate size for the cage mountin has changed. Just got thru by using the weld as part of the foot plate as the total area required.
socram,
Sep 25, 3:05pm
Andy is very keen to see the car!It is currently with a very good workshop, north of Auckland and am very, very impressed with the knowledge and the workmanship, but it is up to MSNZ technical department as to whether they pass the cage or not.Fingers crossed.
sr2,
Sep 25, 9:27pm
Hope it all goes well mate, Andy comands a lot of respect with the MSNZ technical department and having him batting for you would be a big asset.
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