If the point of the effort is the most power for the least money and the highest top speed then the turbo wins hands down.
If you just want something cool then its the SC.
If you're only dreaming and not serious then you might as well go for a twin-charger - both units working in tandem as found on some VW engines of late and as aftermarket kits for Toyota engines (4A, 3S) via HKS.
foxdonut,
Jan 20, 1:05am
Could be - Setting up injection in a carb engine seems like a waste of time to me, especially if you have the 1800 ready to go.
To be honest I don't know the engine at all though, so whats needed specifically I couldn't tell you.
A wrecked AW11 toyota will probably have everything you need, minus the computer, same as a Levin. SC14 is off that people mover thing - uh, Toyota Emina (!) or whatever they call it,
Mostly you'll need money.
jezz43,
Jan 20, 1:10am
well its definately not for speed or power, just a bit of fun and something different. it was a pretty basic looking car and now has a widebody kit being fitted. im not worried about the cost at the moment. but in saying that, i dont want to spend 15k on a car that was originally worth $1500.
foxdonut,
Jan 20, 1:12am
Yeah, hence me writing lower compression.
They were ceramic tipped btw.
aragorn2003,
Jan 20, 1:22am
If your going to keep the carb go supercharger , if you go efi go turbo.
gsimpson,
Jan 20, 1:27am
For inspiration look at what what the FIAT group have already done. Eg Lancia Volumex. Beefed up FIAT 1995 DOHC unit with 1 litre rootes blower. Simple pull through carb system. All that is required is a relief valve on inlet manifold (in case of backfire), lower compression and getting the pulley sizes right for desired amount of boost. The blowers are reliable, mine has done 296000km and has had nothing done apart from oil changes.
mgmad,
Jan 20, 1:40am
It depends entirely on what you want. If you just want lots of power, go turbo. If you want lots of mid-range torque and good drivability, go supercharger.
BTW, good luck finding a cheap Metro Turbo. Due to being scavenged for Minis there are very few left, and those that are go for good money.
jezz43,
Jan 20, 2:42am
im quite keen on the supercharging idea. its different. how often do they require oil changes! is that about all there is for maintenance!
gsimpson,
Jan 20, 3:47am
They have their own oil reservoir for the drive gears so is not contaminated by the engine oil. I change the oil every 2 years (only about 500ml). The non drive end bearings are greased so I remove cover and smear a bit of grease over them. I use Castrol VMX. A little gets sucked past the seals so check level every couple of fills. (only needs a capful) No other maintenance required apart from checking drive belt. Although if that fails there is no damage you just lose boost (and power steering in my case)
jezz43,
Jan 20, 3:51am
that sounds like a good idea then. just need to find something that will work on it. i dont want a high amount of boost. its just for a bit of fun, more for being different. so maybe 5-6psi! im unsure of how turbo boost stacks up against s/c boost. is it still the same! also can s/c's start generating boost at a lower rev range than a turbo!
foxdonut,
Jan 20, 9:24am
The sc12 Toyota unit makes 8 pound standard and will go up to 15 in the aw11. It could go higher, but the pulley is limited by physical space. Your supercharger won't make much more peak horsepower, what it gives you is low end tourque, which is a lot more useful. The sc Toyota series have a cltch that disengages the unit at low rpm / throttle, but a more basic setup will run at idle.
They benefit from lower compression and an intercooler, the 4agze uses a Denso top mount, which you could probably add to your 1800. A bonnet scoop would look cool and make it functional.
It's seems to me that the engine being used is going to dictate a lot of the terms. You'll likely also need a piggyback or new ecu on it too. Possibly pistions as well.
(if you're going to do the job properly)
jezz43,
Jan 20, 4:58pm
im pretty sure the engine is mechanical. it doesnt appear to have alot of wiring around it except for the usual sensors etc, however it does have an electronic dash and some kind of computer type thing next to the battery.
socram,
Jan 20, 9:11pm
Before turbos were a common fitting, superchargers were popular on all sizes of engine, pre and post war. Ever heard a supercharged 1930's 1500cc ERA or s/c 750cc Austin on full song!And what about the s/c 1500cc V16 BRM!500 BHP back in 1950.Still the best sounding engine ever made - Nick Mason, he of Pink Floyd fame, has one.Unreliable maybe, but until you have witnessed that engine live, you have no idea what a remarkable sound it has - and by live, I do not mean on U Tube.
mgmad,
Jan 20, 9:25pm
Indeed socram, and plenty of small MGs prewar with blowers - 750cc R type with a shade under 150hp in 1935, and the works K3s with their 1100cc straight 6 and up to 28 psi boost. all unsilenced, sound brilliant.
doug207,
Jan 21, 2:44am
Twincam head and an SC12 might see you make 150hp.
jezz43,
Jan 21, 3:33am
standard 1600 is only 83hp the 1800 is 120hp tho bog standard im definately leaning towards the charger tho.
foxdonut,
Jan 21, 5:44am
If it works like it did on the Toyota you'll probably get another 30 horse out of it. Torque will go right up too - maybe 25-33%. You could boost its nuts off up to 200 horse with an SC14 and a 16 pound pulley and a dose of nitrous. Anyone's guess how long it will run before it melts though.
If you can't find anything on TM, you may need to search a little further out. I'm told there's some other auction site on the Internet and I'm guessing you'll find what you need for as little as 300 dollars.
pollymay,
Jan 21, 6:04am
It's all efficiency. Turbos use a waste product to force in more air, superchargers use engine power. Old roots blowers are not efficient. However with modern superchargers you can get very high efficiency and no lag.
I'm a turbo person, I know supercharger people to and their reasoning is turbo is a dyno queen where as the lagless supercharger wins in the real world. I disagree as long as the turbo is the right size.
The supercharger if you pick up and SC12 could be suck through in theory which is a big upside. They are not bothered like turbos by fuel droplets and in fact like it as it cools the supercharger which I believe is teflon coated or something. Bolt it on, jet it and go. Just watch the pulley sizes and alignment. Then again turbos are cheap, TD04 off a suby (or similar) will run you $30-$50 cause no one wants them.
If it's vacuum advance you may want to back the timing off a few degrees to if you stick with that system
jezz43,
Jan 21, 6:09am
i see alot of the toyota chargers for sale here, as low as $200. but im assuming they are for use with fuel injected motors. id rather stay with carbs so, whats a charger i can use with my existing carby! i cant seem to find anything here thats remotely close
pollymay,
Jan 21, 6:21am
Everything will be "made" for an efi engine. At least anything readily available. The tricky bit is picking something that will work properly. The SC12 will, I think mazda does a better twin screw charger on something, might be worth looking at.
You can box the carb in, drawthrough or go really low tech and add a "dumb" injector triggered by boost. Or water injection would work fine, no need to alter ratios cause the water does the piston cooling. Lots of ways
foxdonut,
Jan 21, 7:59am
Look for:
Arnott, Arbarth, or volumex.
Eaton and Paxton _may_ have made a few, but I think for bigger motors.
Jackson Racing might also be an option, maybe.
You're unlikely to find one domestically - its going to likely be an import job.
The turbo uses exhaust gases sure but must cause some restriction in system and likely to use more fuel than non turbo option likewise the Volumex Lancia doesn't use much more fuel than it's non supercharged cousin with same basic motor. (unless you have a heavy right foot) There are advantages and disadvantages for both systems but efficiency is not really a major consideration between them. The Sprintex type screw compressor gives a steady delivery of air compared to the Rootes type as in the Volumex.
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