Modern turbos - reliability?

Hi all,
Juat moved back to Christchurch from being overseas for 7 years - now shopping for a car.

Have previously had Subarus in NZ and VW's overseas so on the list is a VW Golf Gti (MK 5), Subaru Legacy GT ('05 onwards) and a Mazda 3 MPS or Mazda 6/Atenza MPS.

I'm wondering the reliability of modern turbo'ed cars! Are they a sound bet if a good example to start with if regular maintenance is kept up!

In my youth I recall stories of turbos needing to be replaced every 100k km's (or less!) and a whole host of associated issues - but suspect things have changed a bit.

Also, are there high maintenance costs! Last Subaru I owned was non-turbo but extremely reliable and ok to run as a young lad and my VW in the UK was a work vehicle so out of touch with current servicing costs - I would be more likely to use a local 'specialist' garage in Christchurch such as Clunie Automotive as opposed to a dealer or franchise.

Car would be used mainly during evenings and weekend and for long trips around the country as I cycle to work.

Not too interested in the usual 'I wouldn't go near a VW/euro trash car or a Subaru with a barge pole' type stuff - all cars have their issues if not cared for and I don't wish to drive a boring Toyota or dull Nissan - not wishing to offend anyone of course! - simply just like the cars I have on my list that offer what I am after :)

Thanks in advance ~

I think modern turbo's can be very reliable. Like anything they need to be treated right and looked after

You have started a thread on an interesting topic, with a long post, but I predict that will be beaten for sheer number of words very soon. Good luck with whichever vehicle you choose to buy.

OH DEAR !euro trash,big mistake my friend.

I can hear Jazz winding up from my place

Last GT subaru I had the turbo was fine at 200+km. It was the cooling system that had issues.

the only thing id touch the vw with is the olympic torch!nothing wrong with Modern turbos depending on what make of car the turbos in. the older model turbos suffered a lot with main bearing seizure due to the extreme heat the turbo generated but things have vastly improved seen then better motor oils available, quality bearings/seals, added benefits of water/air cooled turbos etc. But like you said the key to reliability is no other than good Maintenance.

subaru.notorious head failures!

MK5 Golf GTI is really good to service and have a super long life engine and transmission.

Just make sure its been running the correct oil and coolant and its hard to go wrong. The only other possibility for trouble is if someone has been running 91 fuel but even then they are pretty forgiving. BTW, run it on 98 unless you can't get it in which case 95 will do the job. 95 won't do any harm but the car will pretty much not be able to get into its fsi economy mode.

Timing belt interval is a big km interval on those (120 or 160K can't remember) BUT its been established that its wise to replace every 4-5 years.

It has the wet clutch DSG which is a very reliable unit but this should be serviced every 60K. This can actually easily be done at home in about 20min if you want to do some servicing yourself. Likewise the timing belt is easy enough to do at home, there are no really specialist tools required. (although the transmission requires a couple of cheapish tools). Timing belt is not overly difficult to do but takes a little longer than some really basic cars (You have to undo an engine mount).

Cost wise. The VW is a little odd. To service it properly and by the book (as I recommend with any car) to take it somewhere costs not much more than a basic runabout. I would expect it will average out around $500 - $600 a year.

However the costs come all at once and then almost nothing until the next big service. In other words you pay around $2000 - $2500 for the "Big Service" and then assuming its on variable intervals (just ask for the variable interval computer to be turned on) you will usually only have 2 -3 basic oil and filter changes in between.

So, my advice is budget on doing the big service straight away so you know where you are at and then more than likely you will have a phenomenal run.

You can get the servicing done by any competent general garage or if you are mechanically minded do it yourself. I am happy to give you a guide and a list of tools you will need.

Its also worth noting that despite the fantastic drive and performance, the economy you will get from the VW is amazing. Driven normally it will actually be more economical than some of the little 1300cc 4 speed auto shopping baskets from Japan.

One last thing to mention, while the transmission is actually pretty forgivingin terms of if its missed some servicing. Many have had no servicing at all and have highish km's now. Personally (and this is just my own rough shot in the dark guide) I would buy one that's not had a transmission service with say up to around 100'000km and then service it straight away. I have pulled the transmission oil out of such examples and its been really clean so should be a fairly good educated guess.

Good idea to come back to me if you get one and I will be more than happy to give you an idea as to what to check the garage is doing and what to do if you want to service yourself. Overall though, the Golf is very cheap to run and own. You will be hard pressed to find a cheaper car (in terms of fuel + service costs over time) and will have to go into real basic and gutless shopping cart stuff to match or better it.

Excellent choice, certainly my pic of hot hatches under 25K, there is almost nothing else that comes close to being as good overall and it absolutely blows most of the competition right out of the water.

You where right but wait there will be more to come

Actually yes. but just a short extra note for the moment.
Don't forget to consider the A3 Turbo as well, its pretty much the same car with just cosmetic changes. Sometimes its the cheaper version to buy.

Just be aware though, VW's seemed to be sold more in "packages" as opposed to the buyer sitting down and picking individual options. As a result oddly the Audi version can sometimes be quite low spec compared to the VW. So take the time to compare what you are actually getting with individual cars before buying.

Oh and in direct reference to your original question. The majority of modern VW's (starting late MK5) are turbo charged including shopping basket models. With the correct oil and change intervals I wouldn't expect any trouble under 200K. You may even get a lot more out of one than that and they are easy enough to get in and change if you need on the Golf anyway.

I would be more concerned with whether the transmission has been serviced and other aspects like that.

Tell us all you know about these notorious head failures then as i suspect your talking crapiola. I had a 1991 rs legacy imported many years ago before every man and his dog had 1. Sold it at 160000 kms and it never missed a beat .I miss that car it was a goody. Had a twin turbo gt and that never failed either, it was just never as fun as my rs .

took youre time jazz

Not been on much lately.

The head failures follow the cooling system failures sub engines great sub cooling systems absolute crap from an ex sub owner

Yet another note. while I think of it.
Should you want to do the servicing at home yourself. The parts for the "Big Service" including transmission fluid and filter cost me something like $1300 when I last did one early this year.

In fairness though, while I use genuine parts and go pretty nuts with how thorough I am I did spend some time shopping around to do it for that.

Amazing value though, I can post the very long list of parts I got for that if you want. I think you would struggle to do that well on parts prices even for a shopping basket.

Its also worth mentioning, while I said allow for 2 - 3 basic fluid and filter type services between big services. Personally with my fairly sympathetic driving style and km's, I would only need one fluid/filter change between big services.

I prefer a 4 year timing belt interval and my driving gets the full 2 years between fluid changes.

Mazda 3 MPS with three pedals on the floor over the Golf every day of the week.

Why anyone would want a 'fun' car with a auto tragic gearbox with paddles that you will only use on the first day of ownership is beyond me.

Thanks for the replies all - SW20, exactly - a manual is definate, thankfully even the other half prefers a manual. Do you own a Mazda 3/Axela MPS! Any experience with one!

Jazz - thanks for the info, all very helpful. What is the story with the variable interval servicing! I assume the car notes how much it's being used and signals for a service when necessary!

Anyone know the issues to look for with a later model Legacy!

Also likewise for an MPS! I've read about the VVTi and rear diff issues with the 6 MPS's.

Cheers

My flatmate had a new mps mazda 3. Fantastic car to drive. Had enough go for when you need it fun to drive without overly hard suspension and the interior was well built. It was brand new, so I dont know how they age.

if you buy a sooby, get it checked at tha AA not VTNZ. made that mistake. If they tell you there's oil leaking, rocker covers are not a big job. main seal (back of motor) is. If its missing, save yourself $600 dont buy it. If its not boosting, same thing. Otherwise, we have a GT30 wagon, goes non stop, nil issues, all iv replaced in it was a relay, and its a f**kin great car :)

Your welcome, don't forget to come back for more info if you decide to get one. I am happy to help you find a good one and guide you through getting servicing sorted etc.

With regard to variable servicing, there is a bit more to it than monitoring how much the car is used but you get the idea.

The computer actually monitors a range of functions, mostly it looks at fuel economy but it also looks at throttle positions, rev's, gear changes and other factors. From that information it deduces how hard the car is being driven and what sort of use it is getting i.e city our country driving.

Its a better system IMO as it better reflects when fluids and filters might need attention. So you don't pay for more or less servicing than you need.

Depending on how you use the car you might get as much as 38'000km/2 years between services, or significantly less if your use demands it.

Remember modern quality synthetic oils don't deteriorate with age alone anywhere near as much as mineral oils do. So if the oil remains fairly free from contaminants its still going to be doing a good job even at 2 years old.

Your welcome, don't forget to come back for more info if you decide to get one. I am happy to help you find a good one and guide you through getting servicing sorted etc.

With regard to variable servicing, there is a bit more to it than monitoring how much the car is used but you get the idea.

The computer actually monitors a range of functions, mostly it looks at fuel economy but it also looks at throttle positions, rev's, gear changes and other factors. From that information it deduces how hard the car is being driven and what sort of use it is getting i.e city our country driving.

Its a better system IMO as it better reflects when fluids and filters might need attention. So you don't pay for more or less servicing than you need.

Depending on how you use the car you might get as much as 38'000km/2 years between services, or significantly less if your use demands it.

Remember modern quality synthetic oils don't deteriorate with age alone anywhere near as much as mineral oils do. So if the oil remains fairly free from contaminants its still going to be doing a good job even at 2 years old.

BTW, not sure which VW's you had overseas but if you are yet to drive a MK5 GTI that's the first thing I would do. It may make the decision making very easy, especially if you flick the economy meter to instant (button on the end of a stalk). I think you will be blown away by how economical they are considering the power they have.

Also, have a good play with the transmission, the DSG just blew every other transmission auto and manual away when it came out. The GTI has the paddles as well which complete the package beautifully. It just works so well, be it in auto or manual mode, in the city or the twisty stuff it just does exactly what it should. Especially when you compare it to other manufacturers attempts at a similar setup. Its the icing on the cake of a really fantastic vehicle all round.

Happy shopping!

but of course that applies to any vehicle, regardless of whether it has some fancy system to tell you when to change the oil.

It may apply if the vehicle specs a quality oil, however you can't safely take advantage of it if the computer isn't keeping an eye on the build up of contaminants.

And how exactly is the golf computer keeping an eye on the build up of contaminants!

All they usually have is a counter built into the firmware that counts down possibly taking into account certain engine parameters in the way it counts down (unlikely though).Alot of inkjet printers use this method to "guess" when they are going to run out of ink.