Harder for police, or that's what this headline should read! http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/7884609/Numberplate-tracker-may-be-illegal At what point do they allow "political correctness" to run so rampent it means the police can no longer do their jobs. Having seen an ANPR camera in action and seen the results it turned up (including 3 drivers wanted for petrol driveoffs and 2 stolen cars) I'm all for it.
rpvr,
Oct 30, 2:34pm
Agreed, it's using technology instead of manual methods to police what should be policed. I would like to see it used to get all unlicensed and unwarranted cars off the road.
mm12345,
Oct 30, 2:46pm
If you read the article, then it's reasonably well explained that the concerns are about data retention and/or for possible later use. It's not a "political correctness" issue, but a basic human right not to be under constant surveillance by government, and at least in some countries, "dragnet" methods using data matching have been found to be unconstitutional. As far as loss of privacy being worth the benefit - of catching more criminals goes, it's usually flawed.In this case, any criminal can evade detection/apprehension by carrying a set of legitimate plates and some double-sided tape with them when they go on a night out stealing cars. If the information collecting power of the state is comparable or exceeds that of the Stazi or KGB, then the only thing that you've got to assure yourself that the old saying "if you aren't doing anything wrong, then you haven't got anything to worry about" will remain true, is a belief that government will always be benevolent.History suggests that's a very optimistic view.
berg,
Oct 30, 3:02pm
I can see both sides of the argument but I can also see we are rapidly heading towards being a country where police are ankle tapped by red tape and only the criminals will have any rights. Already getting to that point now. The "alter ego Berg" is wondering if this is just a way to stop police working far more effectively thus removing the "you're only revenue gathering" bitch factor.
curlcrown,
Oct 30, 3:16pm
This is to big brotherish. Many many faults with it. For one suppose a vehicle was registered to a disqualified driver but some one else was driving it, his wife perhaps. That sort of thing must happen all the time.
studio1,
Oct 30, 3:30pm
Their adage that "if you aren't doing anything wrong, then you haven't got anything to worry about" is simply political dribble to justify the new systems. I am aware of two situations where people who are doing nothing wrong have been stopped and interrogated (=harassed) then sent on their way without even a "sorry for interrupting your day". These people weren't doing anything wrong, so this philosophy of only using the technology to 'catch criminals' is flawed. Just another way for the government to control the people and anyone who thinks that nz isn't becoming a police state needs to wake up.
clanky,
Oct 30, 3:31pm
They use this in the UK. It flags cars that have no insurance, no WoF, no rego, have been used in crimes, are registered to wanted crims. Works a treat. Over there, no WoF, no rego or no insurance means a one-way trip to the crusher. They are targeted becuse they reckon that people who break those laws are also more likely to break others.
nightsky1,
Oct 30, 3:32pm
I can remember when community cards were being introduced.The civil libers said it was just more state control.Same with putting photos on Drivers Licences, they said that was just evil. I can also remember the controversy and shock / horror (still) with CCTV cameras all round cities.
Well the sky hasn't fallen just yet so maybe all the hand ringing and twitching by the likes of our privacy commissioner should just be told to F. off and let the cops do their job.
What's the worst that can happen. ! More crims get caught and how bad is that.
I get fed up with doom Sayers.
bill-robinson,
Oct 30, 4:09pm
so the car gets stopped as in your story. Driver produces a valid license as required by law, no problem, but the police check is worth it.
rpvr,
Oct 30, 4:32pm
I am on the road for work and have been stopped many times for WOF and rego checks, drivers licence checks, breath testing, etc. Always OK and simply drive on. What's the issue! The small interruption to my day is insignificant compared to the benefit of safer roads.
kazaral,
Oct 30, 4:33pm
I agree with the way the police use it, what I disagree with is that they are storing the data. Why do they need to! I am also aware of a couple of traffic survey companies that use mobile ANPR and I know they are storing plates as well. So I think this may stretch beyond the police.
mm12345,
Oct 30, 5:44pm
But more crims aren't getting caught, and it's delusional to expect that this is going to make any difference.It'll be great for enforcing reg/wof and the associated revenue gathering business scheme that police (keep denying that they) are running. Crime resolution rates have fallen to about 40% - from 60% or so before we had photo drivers licence, DNA testing, police computer systems.For theft and car conversion, resolution rate is only about 20%. The more tools that get added to the police arsenal, the worse it seems to get.Crims will just do what they need to (continue to) do to avoid getting caught - the assumption that all crims are all stupid isn't right.
pico42,
Oct 30, 5:59pm
I struggle to see a problem with your examples. The police stopped and questioned them, no problem was found so they carried on with their day! Sound like good policing to me.
nightsky1,
Oct 30, 6:02pm
I have no problem with them using it for revenue gathering. If I have to have a current wof and reg so should everyone else. The more law breakers they catch the better. and if I ever get stopped for no reg or wof - it is because I decided to drive without one. -my fault Called taking responsibility for actions.
bellky,
Oct 30, 6:07pm
Excellent.
bashfulbro,
Oct 30, 7:07pm
Only the law breakers , will be against this, it`s a great idea.
curlcrown,
Oct 30, 7:09pm
What would it be like if every one was penelised for every single traffic vilation they ever made! It's just one step closer to that.
curlcrown,
Oct 30, 7:11pm
The problem with this is that people trust the police and the govenment to much to be 100% trustworther with this sort of think. Who watches them and makes sure it is not being abused!
mm12345,
Oct 30, 7:23pm
So if the law said that you needed to pay for a little sticker to put on your bicycle, or on your shoes if you walk - both of which are reasonable "user-pays" economic rationalist arguments for reimbursement of the cost for social services (footpaths, pedestrian crossings, cycleways, ACC etc), then it would be okay to have law enforcement officers stop and check you anywhere, and issue heavy fines if your "walker registration" isn't valid, or if the shoes you were wearing didn't meet the required standard for injury mitigation. I say stick it up government's @rse. My example might seem ridiculous or extreme, but it's only a matter of degree - public acceptance of a compromise, that the state becomes more and more involved in micro-managing an entire society, with greater intrusion into private lives in order to enforce these laws. NZ is a pathetic nanny-state in many ways - from ridiculous cycle helmet laws, building consent laws, WOF, car crushing etc.There's some crazy assumption that the state is there to protect us from ourselves, and needs to introduce laws to "protect our freedom", when all laws are ever there to do is restrict freedom - compromises which may be tolerated for the "common good". Welcoming draconian laws with open arms - and not subjecting all proposed new laws to the highest scrutiny - is IMO a death wish against freedom.
bill-robinson,
Oct 30, 8:00pm
Give us a yell when you find utopia, I'll join you
thewomble1,
Oct 30, 9:07pm
You are captured on CCTV cameras all the time and the pics etc are stored so what is the difference to having your number plate stored. If you do no wrong nothing to fear.
bellky,
Oct 30, 9:11pm
More excellent :)
bitsy_boffin,
Oct 30, 9:24pm
Interrogating the (potential/probable) identity and whereabouts of people without justifiable cause, sounds great.Of course, why not just have random house searches.
"Hullo Mrs, we're here to search your house, not that we have a justifiable reason to do so, but you have been randomly selected to see if you are a criminal, if you have nothing to hide.".
bellky,
Oct 30, 9:27pm
I don't drive a vehicle unless its got current a wof and reg, but I have a car that I don't use much and I let the wof run out.
.Now I'm on the road going to get a wof at vtnz in that car, all perfectly legit when one of those cameras spots me. Next week I get a ticket in the mail for no wof and reg (was going to renew reg when I got the wof).
.So I send a letter explaining everything and I should be let off. I never hear back. (I am lead to believe never hearing back in fact does happen.)
So at the end of the day we are paying the govt to monitor our every move.
petermcg,
Oct 31, 12:21am
Man I agree with all of this, at least someone is making sense,, most of what we read on here is dribble. We need more people to think like you. Excellent,, top marks.
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