Would the emissions cheating scandal affect used car prices of VW and Audi in NZ?
Is the manipulation restricted just to emissions testing? What about other tests such as safety and reliability?
brapbrap8,
Sep 22, 4:09pm
The only issue I could see, is if VW has to update their cars to try and meet the emissions requirements 100% of the time is that reliability may suffer as so many faults these days are caused by emissions control equipment such as the DPF or EGR system.
However I don't think VW is alone in cheating the emissions tests, more manufacturers will get in trouble now that the spotlight is on it.
robotnik,
Sep 22, 4:10pm
Probably not as used Volkswagen prices are pretty good anyway as Kiwis don't value used Euro vehicles.
mm12345,
Sep 22, 4:15pm
I think it's possible that VW/Audi could be using the same cheat on their petrol cars.
brapbrap8,
Sep 22, 4:23pm
The thing is, that having high emissions doesn't really affect consumers. If their fuel economy was not as good in real life as in the tests then I could understand it would affect resale values, but I'm sure most people wouldn't know, or care how much emissions their vehicle produces.
poppy62,
Sep 22, 4:28pm
Reading fairy stories again! Not everyone like you lacks ambition, they actually aspire to not be mundane and unsophisticated.
That's one of VW's US ads. You'd struggle to find another recent example of any global corporate being so deliberately deceitful - or at least being caught carrying out such an ironic fraud.
I hope they pay dearly for this. A message needs to be sent.
tamarillo,
Sep 22, 5:34pm
Go poppy!
tamarillo,
Sep 22, 5:38pm
Why? It's a different scenario surely? They can clean a petrol using standard tech so why would they need to? I understood this was to do with trying to get diesels past the very tough US standards. Hence many auto makers simply don't even try to supply their diesel passenger cars into U.S. Market.
tamarillo,
Sep 22, 5:41pm
We don't know anywhere near the full story yet. We've no info as to whether this is US market cars only, which is a sound theory as its their regs that are the problem. Read one article criticising epa saying the European tests have been checking for special TEST ONLY devices and software for years.
poppy62,
Sep 22, 6:08pm
VW should hit back at the Petro-corps, intimating that the Diesel products they are producing, have additives and nano particles/technology that affect the performance and emissions of their engines and that, they are unable to break down the said additives etc.,which, by the way, boosts the diesel products performance and the reason for the sustainability of diesel engine production in the first instance. Therefore, VWs' reasoning should be based, up on them, building their diesel engines, to a standard that is only commutable with the product that is required to run their engines and that Petro corps had better clean up their end first.
mm12345,
Sep 22, 6:11pm
Sure we don't know the full story yet, but it's not the US regs per se that are the problem, as it's very clear that use of any device or method by the auto manufacturer to defeat emissions is completely illegal, hence as well as the penalties VAG USA face from EPA, the DOJ is probably also going to lay criminal charges. Perhaps a fault with the regs is allowing self-testing/disclosure by the manufacturers, but in reality if you're going to set standards then the methodology has to be disclosed, so it probably makes very little difference. What will change is that now "cycle beating" has been taken to a whole new level, real-world testing using portable equipment might disclose just how widespread lower-level cycle-beating is with all auto makers. I have less faith in the Euro tests than you do. The Euro makers and regulators are deep in each other's pockets, and the auto industry is such a big earner, then Euro manufacturers (which include non Euro owned makers with plants in Europe) collaborate in setting standards. They don't dream up an emission target then dump it on the auto makers as a nasty surprise. They work with the makers to set timescales for achievable targets - and no doubt there is a lot of compromise from both sides.
Anyway, from reading some German newspapers on line, it's clear that their regulators are now going to look very hard at how these VAG diesel engines meet agreed Euro standards. The green movement in Germany is politically very strong and active - I doubt they'd show any mercy if VAG does the same trick there.
VAG shares have crashed about 20%.
mm12345,
Sep 22, 6:17pm
No. VAG should find out who made the decision, who else was involved and knew about it, very actively assist US DOJ in criminal prosecution even if that means extradition of staff from outside the US, fully compensate all owners, pay EPA fines, apologise, and promise to never do it again.
klrider,
Sep 23, 2:53pm
That would be great, come out fighting after being caught commiting one of the largest vehicle frauds in history and just blame someone else. Are you trying to maintain the value of a european POS?
countrypete,
Sep 23, 3:13pm
So you somehow believe that buying a European car makes you "sophisticated"? Sadly, that pretty much sums up the reasoning of many euro buyers.
kazbanz,
Sep 23, 3:20pm
You guys know Im no VAG fanboy. But I suspect there are a whole bunch of VERY nervous MD's at a whole bunch of manufacturers right now. Key areas of "cheating" 1)Emissions. 2)noise 3)fuel economy 4)Safety. If investigators start to dig into those areas in a serious way I wonder how many will come out clean. -or at least only a bit grubby. Particularly US manufacturers
fordcrzy,
Sep 23, 3:40pm
how this all blew up was a university checking dyno emissions vs road emissions and the VWs failed . the other cars were very close to the dyno numbers so im guessing its limited to VW
fordcrzy,
Sep 23, 3:47pm
when you look at the likes of Mazda not being able to get thier 2.2 diesel on the mazda 6 to pass US emissions id have to say VW are on a hiding. if Mazda couldnt engineer a solution on thier biggest selling car into the U.S even with thier skyactive engineering. well its says it all IMO.
mm12345,
Sep 23, 3:51pm
Yes I read that - it's included in letter from CARB to VW. I'd mentioned that I'd read some posts in US VW forums, where Caliifornian owners had experienced problems getting the (almost new) cars through DMV smog tests. The solution suggested was to take the cars to a different DMV test station. VW dealerships were telling them to do that. Now that should have raised the alarm that something was up.
countrypete,
Sep 23, 4:20pm
There are certainly manufacturers who manipulate tests to achieve the desired results - eg Ford and GM removing tailgates and other weighty parts from their trucks to lower stated weights and improve fuel economy, but VW have done something completely different. They have DESIGNED and INSTALLED cheat software to cynically mislead the testing regime. There's a big difference.
poppy62,
Sep 23, 4:41pm
Well you need to leave home to find out for yourself . Even in Japan the well heeled (sophisticates) in the main, do not drive around in their homeland products. It's Top of the line Euros for them and the real top sophisticates demand Left hand drive. Meanwhile back here in NZ ,driving your OZmobile in your sophisticated attire of, black singlet, stubbies, jandals and a coiffured mullet, with your arm out the window, down Lincoln Rd Henderson. Sadly. that pretty much sums up the reasoning of many NZs' TV shows of Kiwi sophistication.
pebbles61,
Sep 23, 7:48pm
wat.
klrider,
Sep 23, 8:03pm
How cute, your car defines you. how sad for you also.
mm12345,
Sep 23, 8:31pm
It's been that way for a long time - standard marketing technique for hawkers of all "luxury" manufactured goods. It keeps the business world ticking over. The sad part IMO is when people start believing the myth. Nothing at all wrong with enjoying a nice car. Believing it makes you "better" however. now that's a different story.
kazbanz,
Sep 23, 8:43pm
Um er--really? ohh ok
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