That only applies to a few power suppliers. We're with Ecotricity who have a specific plan for customers with EVs and PV with rates best suited to us. Previously we were with TrustPower who did have a low buy back tariff like most do but definitely no surcharge.
alowishes,
Feb 23, 8:21pm
I read somewhere that if EVERY ice car in NZ was replaced with Nissan Leafs that it would take over half a dozen more medium sized hydro dams to supply the electricity needed to keep the Leafs mobile Food for though.
two9s,
Feb 23, 8:26pm
Please don't ruin Cindy's beautiful soundbites with harsh reality;-)
poppy62,
Feb 23, 8:41pm
A couple of holes in your post. (1) Tesla range not affected by load! So if it was a Ute it shouldn't make any difference, Unless it towed a trailer? Most people who own "City cars" like a Leaf owner don't have towbars on their cars and those that do, and need to go to the dump, are normally within a 25km radius of the dump.
pico42,
Feb 23, 8:43pm
Or one large one? I know of one coming free soon.
apollo11,
Feb 23, 9:02pm
Yeah, ev's aren't going to be everyone's cup of tea short to medium term. But who knows what the boffins will invent next. Flux capacitors, anyone?
tony9,
Feb 23, 9:12pm
So you are happy with increasing the legislation and cost of building activity?
If it was cost effective to put PV panels on the roof of buildings it would happen anyway. Now and for the foreseeable future it is more cost effective to use grid power for domestic and smaller commercial buildings.
Govt mandating of marginal technology has never ended well before.
tweake,
Feb 24, 6:03am
"E-Transit with 1616kg paylaod & 350km range. (1723kg towing in the US market)" thats not due out to next year. its 350km range max ie with no load. its 1616kg payload option ie use a smaller battery pack. plus its tow capacity is not enough.
so my original statement is true, they are crap with weight and towing.
we tend to carry at least 1000kg, tow 2500kg and just to do local work it needs 200km @ max load. end of the day, EV's use up most of their load capacity with batteries just to get some half decent range with light loads. put decent loads on them and the range decreases to the point of not being useable. unless someone can make a super light weight battery that situation will not change.
ev's are great for what they do well, move light loads short distances. but fail horribly at moving heavy loads long distance.
s_nz,
Feb 24, 8:23am
Weight has an impact on EV's, But it isn't small. Aerodynamics on the other hand makes a massive difference at open road speed. Bikes / Ladders on the roof will make a big difference as in post #60. Big boxy trailers like caravans distort the range. can only end up with 1/3rd of rated.
Regarding the E-Transit, You are correct that it is not yet launched.
You are incorrect about the 1616kg payload option using a smaller battery pack. Only once size is going to be offers 67kWh.
I was responding to your statement "EV's simply can't tow or carry large weight" - This is provably false as EV's exist which can tow and carry large weight.
Range & cost continues to be an issue, however the range of EV's is increasing at a rapid rate.
I have a 2014 Nissan leaf with a 24kWh battery. Latest version has a 62kWh battery. Very dramatic increase in not many years. Hopefully this trend continues.
If we follow the UK, Non plug in light vehicles will be banned in 2030, and non pure electric light vehicle's in 2035. If we lag 5 years behind them as I predicted eairler in the thread there will be. 19 years of development before we go EV only for light vehicles. IF EV's range keeps increasing at current trends, we could expect more than tripple what is on offer today.
And for use cases, that EV's don't suite even then, the diesel Transits, hiaces, hilux's etc sold in 2029 will still be on the road and available in the used market for anouther 20 years. This takes us to 2049.
There would also be the option of swapping from a light vehicle into a small truck that is covered under difference (likely more relaxed) rules. Toyota Dyna / Hino Dutro etc.
tweake,
Feb 24, 9:15am
EV's can tow a small about but not enough. some can carry a large load. but they can't do it all and have useable range. which makes them pointless for large loads or towing. hence for all practical purposes they can't do it.
sure there will be niches like vans in cities that can carry loads a short distance.
btw if the payload spec is an option, then something else must change. the only heavy item they can change is the battery pack. hence they will most likely come out with a small battery pack to give high load capacity. you have to love marketing BS.
mazalinas,
Feb 24, 9:16am
Where are all the current apartment dwellers going to charge these vehicles? There's loads of units and high rise apartments up my way with no public transport available and you'd have to have a death wish to ride a bicycle around here.
tygertung,
Feb 24, 7:16pm
Most road users are not actually towing large heavy loads long distances most days.
Most road users are actually carrying almost no loads other than themselves short distances.
bill-robinson,
Feb 24, 8:08pm
there is a hell of a lot of trucks on the roads adding to single people in cars. now i wonder how freight will move with no trucks or will the total weight of trucks be increased to allow for the batteries. you know 40 tonner increased to 70 tons and no road user charges to do local delieries only 25 km radius of home base.
tygertung,
Feb 24, 9:06pm
There are many less trucks than cars on the roads, but perhaps long distance freight could be carried by rail.
s_nz,
Feb 24, 9:14pm
Trucking is a bigger challenge for sure. Note that the proposal referenced in the headline of this thread only applies to light vehicles. Trucks will come later once tech has moved some more.
Can't simply make our heaviest trucks heavier, as they are restricted by bridge strength etc, so for trucks already at max weight, the battery will cut into payload. For the longer range (800km) tesla semi estimates put the battery pack at about 8000kg. A lot less than the 30T you were talking about. Obviously payload is worth $$ for the heaviest truck's, and this is still very significant.
No road user charges are temporary thing. Once EV trucks are common they will be put back on.
First EV truck's we are starting to see are cherry picking eaiser use cases. Primary urban. For example rubbish trucks, and the container company with a truck that is primary used to shuttle empties around the city (3x20" at a time).
It does a set loop around various sites where each leg is less than it's 200km range, and has fast chargers installed for it to use while being loaded and unloaded.
Will be a while until we see the harder use cases tackled.
tygertung,
Feb 24, 9:51pm
Maybe one day there could be rental battery packs, which you just slot in an out, when you get to somewhere and need more battery you just swap out the old battery pack which gets charged and slot in the new one.
That way the batteries could always have a slow charge going on.
tygertung,
Feb 24, 9:56pm
It would require more of a universal system of battery size and fitment.
gazzat22,
Feb 24, 10:09pm
We have nothing like the UK public transport system in NZ and it would take more like 10 years to get anywhere vaguely near it.
gazzat22,
Feb 24, 11:15pm
Have a look on You Tube or similar.Changing Battery packs is not something I would like to do at home and i am reasonably fit and mechanically minded .Its not just a 5 minute job like putting a new battery in a car as at present.!
bill-robinson,
Feb 24, 11:30pm
this is just a feeler not an actual happening I think. the govt are smacking the car as they know the users will pay more tax just to use their existing cars. i wonder what is the proportion of diesel fuel in heavy vehicle use compared to petrol. remember the trucking industry has a superb lobby group protecting their interests, while the motorist used to have the AA but that seems to have joined the govt to earn money with out any respect for irs roots.
s_nz,
Feb 25, 12:14am
Has been tried before, look up project better place. Sadly it failed.
Tesla also built in the ability for robotic battery swaps doe a while. This was basically to qualify for a hydrogen car targeted " rapid refueling subsidy zev subsidy in California. They did run a beta for a while. But it turned out the number of Tesla owners who wanted to swap their pack rather than rapid charge was very low.
We have now probiably passed the point in ev uptake where getting a standardised pack is workable. and I have a feeling this won't be tried again. In the next decade or two for cars at least.
Apparently there are successful battery swap programs for 50cc style electric scooters in Asia. These packs are light enough to swap by hand removing the need for robotics.
tygertung,
Feb 25, 12:48am
I was thinking of some scheme where the battery just sort of slots out the front or something, obviously it would have to be some time in the future.
Something like a 40kWh leaf has a 303kg battery, so best it goes underneath & between the axles.
tweake,
Feb 25, 5:15am
wasn't discussing all road users, simply light commercials. especially utes, which is currently the top selling vehicle in nz. more importantly for tradies, who need to transport a lot of weight. extra cost of them of course get passed on to customers.
tweake,
Feb 25, 5:22am
"With calculations based on an average 5.6 tonne load " its not exactly caring any load. like bread trucks or carting lettuces, or foam. there is always niche uses, but with normal loads your not going to get anything remotely close to 200km. i dare say you may not even get 20km.
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