I agree BUT it was created for a reason. It means an end to special interest cars or vintage cars being allowed in. The obvious answer short term is to extend it to 30 years
3tomany,
Jan 29, 5:06am
The carbon footprint of a classic car would be minimal as the vast majority just sit in a shed and are only driven occasionaly.
gazzat22,
Jan 29, 5:20am
they bought in testing equipment some years ago and rejected it as Not Cost Efficient" aka too expensive.The only Test for emissions is the Ten Second Rule. some years ago they had a Dob In A Smokey 0800 number but all the offending driver/owner got was a letter .
gazzat22,
Jan 29, 5:38am
My understanding is that all cars in the UK when going for a MOT renewal are emission tested but it is on a sliding scale for older vehicles but still with a maximum allowable limit.
stevexc,
Jan 29, 8:22am
Exemptions to the Clean Car Standard are:
agricultural vehicles for farms, such as tractors, harvesters, mowers, toppers, bailers military vehicles special interest vehicles vintage and veteran vehicles scratch built vehicles and modified vehicles certified by the Low Volume Vehicle Technical Association Incorporated.
Can't see anything specific about the 20 year rule. However it is being used to import Toyota Ipsums and Caldinas from the 90s so something needs to change.
stevexc,
Jan 29, 8:53am
This got me thinking. A dealer could sell Nissan Leafs and use the total lack of carbon to offset a second yard full of fuel guzzling V8s.
Personally I've been thinking of buying a 90s Celsior. I better hurry up as this will add 5k worth of carbon charges D:
ascotbks,
Jan 29, 9:38am
going to be tough of labour supporters having to pay much more for jap imports just so labour can keep the green vote. new cars are much to expensive for the average worker. if it wasn't for second hand jap imports the average age of vehicles would be at least 20 years old. better of trying to keep middle of the road voters that swap around. after all greens are never going to support national
socram,
Jan 29, 12:59pm
If they want to reduce emissions, how about getting traffic moving, then into in top gear ASAP?
They've just wacked in speed bumps at the junction of Archers road and Coronation Rd Glenfield. Cars going up Coronation have to slow almost to a stop on and off the ramp, before the junction, then 10m after it, another.
So cars exiting Archers, uphill, and turning right, also have to come almost to a standstill within 20m, as boy, these ramps are really high. I'm pretty sure some cars and vehicles with long overhangs, are going to be scraping the deck.
So what was an economical 50kph, is now two short, slow 2 second gear sections, not to mention giving the suspensions a work out.
Sorry, but that totally negates any potential Co2 savings from newer cars
First gear and second gear means more emissions per km driven than 4th -> top. Get the traffic moving and emissions will drop dramatically.
s_nz,
Jan 29, 2:06pm
This is far from world leading. The 105g target in 2025 (that we likely won't even meet given the low fines), was achieved by Europe last year, and by Japan way back in 2014.
Regarding used car imports, as a whole these currently meet the 2025 standard now. Things like Nissan leaf's, Toyota Aqua, Prius etc are all very popular used car imports, which drags the average down. Also note the fines are half for used imports.
Of course some specialist used car importers who's fleets are heavy with van's, large suv's, performance cars etc will need to buy credits or pay fines.
The bulk of the burden of this will be carried by new car importers who's sell a lot of Utes, SUV's, van's, large car's etc, relative to small car's.
Taking nissan as an example, other than the leaf, There lineup is 4x SUV's, 1x ute, and the mighty GT-R.
Not sure what your fleet mix is. If you have a good number of leaf's, small cars and hybrids in the mix, you may already be under the limit. If not, you will either need to change your fleet mix, or start pricing fines into the higher emitting vehicle in your fleet. The fines don't kick into 2023, and are only $25/g/car for used dealers. If you beat the target, you can sell credits to others.
As a whole, it is likely that the used car industries pricing will move such that more efficient cars are priced cheaper, and less efficient are priced higher. Possiably there will be a bit of a rush on aqua's, leaf's etc at the auctions as importers try to bring their average's down.
This rule applies to vehicles up to 40 years old. I haven't seen an announcement on getting rid of the 20 year exemption to the existing frontal impact and emissions standards yet. That said it has got to be coming. I assume your source is solid given you are in the industry?
s_nz,
Jan 29, 2:08pm
Scheme allows the sale of credits to other importers.
Assuming the industry as a whole misses the target (likely), the value of a credit will be just shy of the fine. Sounds like the fine is going to be $75/g/car in 2025, so lets assume credits are worth $74/g/car. brand like tesla that beats the target will be able to sell to sell $7,548 in credits to other importers. This will allow them to decrease their prices, or take a higher margin (the latter would make NZ a more attractive location to allocate stock).
It's unclear if used car importer can sell their credits to new car importer, and hence get the full price, but it seems logical that they would. Being able to sell $7.5k of credits when you sell a used leaf / iMiev / smart ED from japan is going to make these EV's much more attractive to import and sell (but will likely drive up auction prices in japan).
That said if the above is true, it would create a real messy situation. Every used car dealer would be incentive's to split their company in half. Sell everything emitting below the target from company A, and everything above from company B. Company A sells credits at $74 to mazda etc. Company B pays fines at $37.5 to the government. Share staff, yard etc.
s_nz,
Jan 29, 2:10pm
40 year + cars, vehicles with historic value are exempt:
I have yet to see anything to say the 20 year exemption to frontal impact standards etc is being dropped, but it seems like it would be logical.
s_nz,
Jan 29, 2:25pm
Absolutely. Alternatively a leaf specialist yard could sell credits to a v8 specialist yard so the latter dosn't have to pay fines.
Re the Celsior, penalties kick in in 2023, so you would be best advised to do it in 2021 or 2022. 2022 is going to be an epic last harrah for high consumption vehicle sales.
Anybody with there eye on a v8 powered Y62 nissan patrol (298kW, 334g co2/km) would be best advised to buy it in 2022 or earlier, because come 2023 it is likely around $11.5k of fines will be built into the price.
Also anybody with a strong desire for thee non hybrid version of a vehicle with hybrid variant in the same price ballpark should get in soon. For example swift, corolla, rav4, most of the Lexus lineup etc. Toyota has already announced they will be going hybrid only for the next version of the highlander SUV. In the UK suzuki only offers the swift in the hybrid version.
Also, anybody considering a Landcruiser 70 wagon or troopy should get in quick. The spit limit will make it more attractive for toyota to sell the the ute version, so either the wagon & troopy will become relatively more expensive, or toyota may just drop them from the lineup.
Finally for people eyeing up Plug in cars (especially new), it is likely better deals will be on the table come 2023. Some brands with limited supply (mini?) may even stockpile cars from 2022 so they can take advantage of the credits in 2023.
s_nz,
Jan 29, 2:38pm
This policy should have a net zero of beneficial impact on the used car importing industry as a whole. Japan met our 2025 target way back in 2014, so the pool of vehicles at the auctions is relatively low emitting on average.
For the average worker looking for a commuting car, something like a leaf or Toyota aqua should be significantly cheaper come 2023 as they well beat the target, and as such the importer will be able to use the credits to offset higher emitting cars in their fleet, or to sell to other car importers.
Not sure if you are on the money regarding the politics. This policy was was in the portfolio for labour prior to the election.
s_nz,
Jan 29, 2:42pm
News hub has the Progressive target table.
Targets are a lot more relaxed in 2023 and 2024 than 2015 so some of my numbers above will be wrong.
Seems likely that much of the used car industry will be "in the money" in 2023 especially, with hybrid and electric van's being quite attractive.
[edit] 2023 fine on a new Y62 patrol will be $10,200, rather than the $11.5k I calculated above. Assuming Nissan can't sell enough leaf's to offset it, and keeps the patrol in its lineup.
ascotbks,
Jan 30, 6:56am
all labour did was copy green policy and change name however what ever it will hurt labour inclined voters most of who cant survive with family in a tiny car and need medium size imports which at present can be bought from around $5000 to $8000 for a very nice lowish millage vehicle. i have one. needed a replacement for my nissan caravan van but didnt need quite as large a vehicle so bought a nissan serrena done 65000k for $5000 and took 2 back rows of seats out and it goes well and if by chance anything major went wrong i would just sell it for parts and buy another
secca2,
Jan 30, 11:48am
So what government is saying bottom line is you can bring the vehicle in still pollute the environment but you pay x amount?
kestrel43,
Jan 30, 2:57pm
OK, NZers will have to get used to Kei cars as the popularity of those vehicles are the main reason Japan reached the target in 2014.
gblack,
Jan 31, 2:30am
Do these rules mean that the government will be paying more money to the government for the police cars?
NZ police signed up for the Skoda's which have lower emissions than the Commodores, but believe will still exceed these new standards. Perhaps the police might look at something like a Toyota hybrid (Camry?) again.
paul861,
Jan 31, 2:42am
i would of thought creating incentives for people to live closer to there place of work(not a lifestyle block 50 k away) and closer to the school so kids could be walked or bike rather than mum dropping them off in the suv would be better at reducing our passenger car emmisions
tweake,
Jan 31, 3:42am
its simply cheaper to buy a property out of the city and commute than it is to buy in the city.
one of the big problems with all this emissions stuff is how do people pay for it when most of their income is being spent on overpriced housing and rents.
3tomany,
Jan 31, 3:54am
Probably got less to do with the environment than finding inventive ways to get more tax.
The Govt doesnt like those either because of the lack of crashworthiness. Despite them being obviously ideal in crowded urban areas.
differentthings,
Jan 31, 1:38pm
we will all be driving diesels or on push bikes by the sounds of things. "By 2032, we’ll be cycling twice as much, and you won’t be able to import a petrol car" and forget about using wood to build houses with as well. "Pine plantations would taper off, but native forests would keep expanding because swathes of land will have been planted in government-subsidised native trees. also petrol could become pricer than gold "goods that are likely to rise in price, such as petrol" https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/climate-news/124079047/the-government-will-not-hold-back-jacinda-ardern-on-how-nz-could-go-zero-carbon
gazzat22,
Feb 1, 6:01am
Havent Native trees got a much slower growth rate than exotics like pine thus the attraction for house building.?
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