I have a ???what would you do??? question for WOF Inspectors. I??
kazbanz,
May 10, 6:32pm
You pretty much hit on EXACTLYthe point. Its an old car that is like mechanno to strip and fit parts to. I would say that MOST WOF guys simply wouldn't have a clue if its soposed to have disk or drum brakes. I guessif going by the letter of the law Id say --yep it needsa LVV because THAT car came out with drums.
a.woodrow,
May 10, 6:38pm
I think the problem we have is that there is so much hanging over an avi if they pass something on a vehicle that technically should have failed according to the virm, that some end up over cautious, when really the bottom line should be "is this car safe!". In a case like this, OEM disc brakes are going to be superior to drums, making the car safer.
kcf,
May 10, 6:44pm
LVV cert needed for sure, just in case master cylinder, brake lines, or brake proportioning valve etc is different and the person had accidentally created a deathtrap. . as to what "would" happen, that's going to be either yes or no depending on who you ask.
So
Yes
No.
pauldw,
May 10, 7:31pm
Is the LVV process retrospective!
The Cooper S was introduced in 1963, something like a mini disc conversion could have been done many years before LVV was introduced.
steve312,
May 10, 7:37pm
There was a period of grace when the LVV system was first introduced.It was up to vehicle owners with modified vehicles at that stage to get a certificate stating that the modifications were already in existence prior to the changeover date.Anything after that needs to be LVV inspected.
Owners of modified vehicles now either need to provide the modification cert or have an LVV plate fitted to the vehicle each WOF check.
mrfxit,
May 10, 8:01pm
Needs to be certed
Balance/bias problems can occur because of possible differences between sizes of components within each total system of drum or disk systems. Eg:
Master cylinders (single/ dual line & valve/ seal sizes) Flexi hose's Rear cylinders Proportioning valves Steel lines Brake peddle pad size & lever leverage effect Pad sizes & materials (front & rear)
If the wof guy doesn't see it . Mr Plod / SCU: Serious Crash Unit or Insurance could in the event of an accident
smac,
May 10, 8:16pm
Hmmmm.seems to me people are answering the bit I said I wasn't asking. I was more interested in what would actually happen.the point is, how would you know the car didn't come out with discs! (when some of that year did).
kazbanz,
May 10, 8:22pm
smac again how would they know! so therefore would they question the origonality of the brakes anbd do anything!
smac,
May 10, 8:27pm
Well that's kinda my point.if I have one. There's this rule that says certain things must be certed, but then how on earth is the insepctor supposed to know it's been changed! Obviously an issue with older vehicles (because who would know what OE was) but also with new. If you chip a vehicle and put in new throttle bodies and cam etc and get 20% increase in power, how would the inspector know!
a.woodrow,
May 10, 8:58pm
Probably not a good example as that modification does not need to be certified
smac,
May 10, 9:33pm
Pfft.ok 21%.
Or an example more relevant to my original case - somebody rocks in a 1975 1275GT mini with 8.4" disc brakes. Does that need a cert!
MOST inspectors, would not know. SOME might.
(actually I just rechecked my cam/chip example - if it was a tubo it WOULD need certing, regardless of the 20/21%)
a.woodrow,
May 10, 9:45pm
Correct. Be a bummer if they failed and made you get a dyno test to prove that you weren't over 20%.
But anyways with your original point, some guys would know and some wouldn't, and they would all pass and fail accordingly
mrfxit,
May 10, 9:48pm
DING . yep got that right Part of my point was that if the brakes "felt" a little odd at testing time, then it "could" be because of the mods
a.woodrow,
May 10, 9:49pm
Mini brakes never feel all that great anyway in my opinion - but all mine were only fitted with drum brakes I guess go-kart steering helps compensate for dodgy anchors
smac,
May 10, 10:20pm
Yep, when drums aren't adjusted up properly you can literally switch lanes when braking hard! Not pleasant.
ladatrouble,
May 11, 1:43am
Back to the original question - yes it will need a LVV cert as it didn't have discs as standard. As to it passing or not it depends on the inspector - if they were old enough to have worked on Mini's on a daily basis in the '60's, ''70's and '80's, then they would know it was non standard. A younger inspector who had hardly ever seen a Mini wouldn't know if they were standard or not, so if it looked stock, he would pass it.
zephyrheaven,
May 11, 3:07am
Its a $450odd dollar tax to tell you - youve done it right
LVVTA needs a huge overhaul IMHO
smac,
May 11, 3:49am
Ahh but see after 1984 they all DID have discs.but who's gonna know that, or what kinda discs. I'm not really trying to make any kinda point, I was just curious. I always find unenforceable rules odd.
dave653,
May 11, 3:54am
1996 I bought a 1969 Buick Le Sabre in Auckland. It had a current WOF and reg, I drove it home to Whangarei after paying off the difference to his finance company. Realising the brakes were 'questionable' I decided to look into them a bit more. The original finned alloy drums had been replaced with small, solid disc's, with 'tiny' calipers (probly off a Cortina). They had been 'machined' and fitted, with an angle grinder, the pads were worn on an angle. think 1/4 of an HQ pad. But. it still had a WOF! When I wanted to stop, I had both feet on the stop pedal. and waited. till it actually stopped. This thing was 18 1/2 feet long, must have been a ton and 3/4, but it was 'legal'! I stopped going to VTNZ after too many 'bullshit issues'. Makes you wonder. how many 'legal' shitheaps are out there. I found a set of factory 12" discs with calipers (3 inch piston) that would have bolted on, but makes me think about the legalities I would have encountered to make it legal, with ever changing 'rules'. Don't believe everything they say. gummint don't know shit!
zephyrheaven,
May 11, 4:20am
The above guy is onto it - cert isnt everything
And people bagging drum brakes are either ignorant or too ham fisted to make a good job of working on them
smac,
May 11, 4:39am
Hmmm.yes and no. I am usually a bit of a stubborn defender of drums. I've run them for years and as you've indicated in top condition they will equal discs (hell the mini 7's used to race on them). You can lock the wheels with them and therefore you can't get more braking pressure than discs with them. HOWEVER, I do concede that on a car that is regularly used they are rarely adjusted as often as they need to be (I'd say weekly really), and as a result can end up a bit dodgy, especially in the wet. They fade fast too when thrashed.
ladatrouble,
May 11, 4:39am
Why don't you quote my whole post - I just told you who was going to know what it had originally. I would because I served my apprenticeship working on those things.the guy who works with me wouldn't have a clue because he's never worked on a Mini.
4.8(1) A low volume vehicle that was modified or constructed prior to the introduction date of the Transport (Vehicle Standards) Regulations 1990 is not required to undergo LVV certification,provided that: (a)documented evidence can be provided to substantiate that the modifications or construction pre-dated the relevant introduction date; and (b)no further modifications have been carried out since the relevant introduction date."
also "However, for varying reasons, some vehicles that were built a long time ago are subjected to the LVV Certification process. Common reasons are that cars were built or modified here in New Zealand 20 or more years ago and have been subsequently modified, or vehicles that were built more than 20 years ago overseas are imported into New Zealand and have to under go LVV certification as part of their entry certification process."
snoopy221,
May 11, 7:42am
eVEN THOUGH WE LIVE IN AN osh OVEREGULATED NANNY STATE SOCIETY. imho
no i WOULD NOT FAIL A DISC FRONT MINI [Even if i had passed it as drum].Only DECIDING-FAIL FACTOR WOULD BE
THE DAMN BRAKE READINGS I HAD USED AND NOW WOULD HAVE TO USE. Therin is ya answer.K
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