I sat in a tiida this morning if you are taller than 5.9foot it wont be comfortable to drive
thejazzpianoma,
Jul 25, 1:30am
Fiesta's are very good on fuel. The Ford Territory is completely irrelevant to the Fiesta and its economy as its bigger, heavier and less aerodynamic.
Incidentally, the most economical modern cars tend to have CVT or multi speed transmissions (like 6 or 7 gears instead of 4), electric power steering, direct injection motors and other measures to help with economy. These more economical vehicles are interestingly usually more powerful and smoother to travel in as they are more efficient.
Some cars in the age you are looking at have lots of these features others have almost none. Some vehicles manage to remain very reliable while still having these modern features, others do not. Be ware of cheesy dealers using the supposed "reliability" of the basic inefficient vehicles as a selling point. Its often the only selling point they have and its not always the case that these simpler vehicles are more reliable at all.
The low tech vehicles tend to do nearly as well on fuel on the open road, but around town they start to get stuck into the fuel. This is all assuming you are comparing vehicles of similar size and performance.
thejazzpianoma,
Jul 25, 1:58am
BTW, just to give you a heads up.
If you start talking to dealers about CVT transmissions, Direct injection engines and multi speed automated transmissions like the DSG. Be preparedto be told "you don't want any of those things". unless of course they happen to have such a vehicle on their lot.
Honda, Toyota and Mitsubishi have had some real failures in the CVT and Direct injection departments. Because of this most dealers just assume these technology's to be no good in any vehicle (which is definitely not the case). that and they often want you to buy an over priced low tech vehicle.
Just like on here you will be amazed at the stories dealers will tell to peddle their wares. Some will sound very plausible indeed which makes it quite difficult sorting out the real from the nonsense.
shelleigh,
Jul 25, 2:44am
I took mine up to Christchurch from Oamaru in the school holidays and still had over 130kms in the tank when we got home. Mine has the 6 speed Power Shift and is pretty peppy for an auto. Took it to Dunedin last week and has plenty of pep passing uphills for an auto.
thejazzpianoma,
Jul 25, 2:53am
Didn't realise yours had the powershift. Nice!
BTW, yddac this is what I was meaning by an economical and smooth transmission. The Fiesta and the VW both have much the same setup. Because the transmission has so many gears and uses a new kind of dual automatic clutch instead of the old fashioned torque converter typically found in traditional auto's its significantly more economical. Not to mention smooth and quiet with plenty of zip.
Just doing way with the torque converter can save you around 30% in economy when you are knocking around town. You get the extra saving from more gears on top of that.
These sorts of transmissions are often very low maintenance too, and because the internal parts of the transmission are built more like a manual than an auto they are very reliable too.
In case you are wondering, they are just like driving a normal auto, in fact you wouldn't even know the difference unless someone said. Underneath though they are quite different and are effectively a manual transmission with a robot that changes the gears and operates the clutch instead of a clutch pedal.
Because they have two clutches they change gear literally faster than you can blink which is why they feel like driving an auto.
richardmayes,
Jul 25, 6:59am
Well I'm NOT a car dealer, but the idea of owning a second hand or thirdhand car with a robot gearbox with two robot clutches absolutely terrifies me.
This is unproven technology only a decade old. We are only just now starting to see the first generation of these transmissions grow old and require repair.
No doubt the first owners of these carsenjoyed the slightly better fuel economy with grins on their faces, but complex machinery like that turns from an asset into a liability the day the term of the manufacturer's warranty is up.
I would rather spend a manageable $10 per week extra on petrol than drive around on top of a time bomb like a used DSG or Selespeed gearbox every day.
Hell, I would even rather own something like a CVT Skyline that takes the special gold-plated $1,000 transmission fluid!
[I wanted to finish by saying "Just my 2 cents." but in this context it's more like my eight or ten thousand dollars.]
3tomany,
Jul 25, 7:15am
i dont want to preach and i am a farmer not a car salesman. The point i made is because i bought a new car for my daughter and after driving many small cars the fiesta was so much better than the rest we had to have it and after buying it the experience only got better. I would make my daughter take my new xr6 so i could drive the fiesta it was so good. we since traded it on a ranger because my daughter left home and bought a cheepy for herself. in jazzes defence of his opinion i have never sat in a fiat or anything else he likes so i guess for you the point is jap cars while there reliability is generally good other cars are a way better buy
fordcrzy,
Jul 25, 7:40am
buy a fiesta. they are great. even the 2005-2009 models are great. the new shape ones are phenominal
thejazzpianoma,
Jul 25, 9:03am
If you understood the technology you would realise that DSG style transmissions actually last far better than automatics or CVT's. This is because they are really just a manual transmission with a servo on the clutches and shifter.
The early ones are exceptionally easy to service (drain and refill with an easy to change external filter, I do them at home in my carport) and the fluid is not more expensive than a CVT or Auto.
The late ones require no servicing at all because they use a dry clutch. AND no servicing really means no servicing, its not a "sealed for life" smoke and mirrors game that will actually let you down like some automatics.
These transmissions are super robust, thats why they use them in the likes of the Veyron. They are a decade old and even used in commercial applications where vehicles are literally doing into the millions of km's. The warranty info shows them to be about as reliable as its possible to make a transmission.
To still try and knock them only shows your ignorance. (sorry if that sounds harsh but it is the case).
I suggest you come back when you have actually owned and serviced a few like I have.
richardmayes,
Jul 25, 9:17am
Turn it up, in my world there are plenty of cars with 3-speed borg warner torque converter automatics that have lasted FAR longer than their manual stablemates. The proof's in the proving, not in vehement assertions on the internet. For every positive comment you make there appear to be a couple of people with horror stories. Unless they are all liars!
I am trying to help you understand an alternative viewpoint that you seem to believe is a malign conspiracy of Jap import dealers.
Sorry but it will take more than a bit of righteous fervor on the internet to convince me that a robotised manual gearbox is a good thing to have money tied up in at high mileages.
And even in my position of ignorance I'm pretty confident that whatever transmission the Bugatti Veyron has, it is not the same as a VW Golf one and you do NOT get a 1000 horsepower transmission when you buy a VW Golf.
thejazzpianoma,
Jul 25, 9:27am
Firstly, of course the Veyron is not running exactly the same transmission. However the concept is the same, manual transmissions can be built exceptionally strong. Unlike CVT's for example.
You really are clutching at straws, if 10 years and many individual vehicles with over a million km's on the clock is not long enough to be "proven" for you I would hate to think what is.
I do understand the alternative viewpoint, its just based on fear of something that is percieved as different and against the grain. It dosn't matter that this is the most popular automated transmission in the world, it dosn't matter that the warranty surveys show them to be as reliable as its possible to get in an automatic. Emotions and "gut feeling" will always rule over logic for many, unfortunately that "gut feeling" comes from the sea of "car dealer nonsense" that has infected our automotive trade.
This is the result of a country where the whole second hand car industry revolves around peddling secondhand used imports. Trashing anything not Japanese in an effort to sell over priced and under specc'd vehicles has seeped into the national psyche.
That's why you don't get this absurd sentiment in other countries.
Sorry if I sound harsh and unforgiving, its just frustrating to see posters like the one that started this thread having to contend with unnecessary and baseless nonsense when its a big enough job for them to work on the actual important issues.
countrypete,
Jul 25, 9:32am
Fact is that the DSG is proven.Proven to have problems that is.That's why they have had to counter the bad press it has received in at least one country by the marketing ploy of extending the warranty to pretend there are no issues.(See link in a previous thread).
kazbanz,
Jul 25, 10:18am
Hey splinter-you are 100percent???right cars are dirt cheap here in Japan. But guess what --they haveto get???to nz. be complied and???be made legal on the road. As an examplejust say a car cost me 40000yen (divide by 62 for the dollars)Bythe time???its in NZ on the road it will cost the dealer 5000 and??? guess what-there arent cars we can buy for 40000yen^decent cars that?????
splinter67,
Jul 25, 10:40am
HMMM no money in it you reckon why are you there then not doing it for love are you and if there was no profit in it why do the used car boats keep turning up at our ports
thejazzpianoma,
Jul 25, 10:53am
RUBBISH.
You are quoting an obscure Chinese source because thats about the only poor press you could find after scouring the web. If the most popular automatic transmission in the world had problems it would be obvious. To date we have not even had one first hand person come on this forum with a problem with a DSG.
The warranty survey's show the DSG to be just as reliable as Toyota's most reliable transmission.
Desperately trying to discredit the worlds most popular automated transmission which is also proven to be reliable is just pathetic.
Look for yourself here are the results from the worlds biggest warranty company. Look at how the transmission rated.
And before you go hacking on the general score for the vehicle, it scores much the same as a Mazda 6 or Toyota Avensis and no one complains about their reliability.
Just give it up, your trying to pick holes in something just to try and prove a point is a miserable thing to do to someone who is trying to separate the truth from the friction and make an important and expensive buying decision.
I think you need to look in the dictionary for the meaning of "fact" and "proven".
hijacka,
Jul 25, 11:01am
Now your sounding '' harsh and unforgiving''
thejazzpianoma,
Jul 25, 11:07am
Yip, I just get annoyed. Its the same thing every time with countrypete, he comes along and casts unnecessary doubt and confusion yet what he says is completely baseless. He has zero experience with the transmission in question and can't even provide any sort of backing for his argument.
It dosn't seem to matter how many times he is shown the warranty figures or its pointed out that we have not even had one person with one fail come on here first hand.
He just likes to troll and its very unfair to those trying to make an expensive decision. Its also unfair on me because every time I have to go through the same story of actually showing the facts.
It would be different if he had a fair argument or critisisim that had some sort of factual basis, but he dosn't. He just jumps on anything he can find that might remotely point to a transmission somewhere having a problem and then tries to pretend that's a trend.
Even his Chinese link is a joke, VW wouldn't be offering a 10 year (YES 10 YEAR) warranty on their transmissions over there if there was really a problem.
countrypete,
Jul 25, 8:54pm
Jazz, your misinformation knows no bounds!My concern is merely to correct the rubbish you are spouting.I am quoting facts.Here's a quote:"Problems with VW's DSG transmission have been well document, especially for the 7-speed dry clutch DQ200 unit. Early March this year, China's national quality watchdog AQSIQ (General Administration of Quality Supervision, Inspection and Quarantine) summoned representatives from VW to discuss on DSG related woes amongst Chinese consumers.""Volkswagen regrets that the DQ200 (seven-speed) gearboxes have inconvenienced some of our Chinese consumers and pledges to take such complaints very seriously and make every effort to satisfy Chinese customers," the company said.
Nowfirstly that's not "an obscure Chinese source", it's partly a quote from VW itself.
Potential buyers of cars with this transmission need to do their own research (google is your friend) and make their own conclusions.You're right that fact needs to be separated from fiction for someone spending a lot of cash to buy a new car - that's what I am pointing out.Jazz, you're incredibly biased towards the VW product - good on you, but don't let that get in the way of reality.That reality is that, in general use, the DSG has manifested significant problems.You simply cannot deny this, as any quick search will confirm.
You don't need to take my word for it - just look for the facts.
thejazzpianoma,
Jul 25, 9:22pm
If it has manifested so many problems why don't you quote some figures then!
I have quoted figures from a very reliable source, you just quoted a link from the chinese market. where VW has so much faith in its transmission its extended its warranty to 10 years! Its also entirely possible that the transmissions and cars in question are entirely different to what is being discussed here, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the problems are related to some cheap China only version of a vehicle as is often made for that market.
Why not quote some actual figures for the car in question like I have!
I am really over your constant trolling with no backing, put up or shut up.
Still trolling for evocative sounding links I see with no real numbers to back anything. In the absence of anything sufficient to support your cause you are even making up quotes now.
The only numbers in your story's were a couple of faulty batches of less than 20'000 units each. That might sound a lot to someone who isn't savy (which is a shame because thats the damage you are doing) but when you consider the millions and millions of these transmissions that are in circulation thats absolutely nothing.
Anyone who actually understands the numbers will only be more reassured they are as reliable as you can get if that's the best you can find on the entire internet to diss them.
You are just playing silly emotional games like car dealers do with no fact to back yourself up.
I have provided the actual numbers and those numbers are as good as it gets for any transmission.
kazbanz,
Jul 26, 1:17am
did i say there was NOPROFIT !no I did NOT but the profit is nowhere near what you think it is>
carstauranga001,
Jul 26, 1:18am
Remember the person here a while back who was facing a $10,000 repair bill on a VW transmission! And someone gave us a link to an earlier thread when she had sought advice.Jazz (as usual) told her to buy the car as nothing goes wrong with them. If I was her I would have been very pi**ed off. I can't be bothered finding the old threads, maybe someone else can.
splinter67,
Jul 26, 1:30am
Hmmm one person I know Imports and sells used Japanese cars I know what He makesDosent drive a used import neither dose his wife 2 race cars and all he sells is used imports clever car dealers make lots
carstauranga001,
Jul 26, 1:36am
Right, easy search found it. Check out threads from kelsie21. Makes good reading.
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