Hey look Im not passing judgement. I'm simply offering my honest opinion as to what's going to happen. I have every reason to dislike the New car (franchise) industry so its not "wishful thinking" My genuine concern is the judgement will go against you and you end up stuck with no car as the dealer withdraws the offer of the longblock. Now the dealer I can 100% assure you does not want to go to MVDT so one option is to look for a "middle of the road" compromise and offer it pre hearing. Say a $5k contribution by you. --not ideal but a lot better than what I feel is going to happen.
kazbanz,
Feb 5, 12:23pm
A long block is just that--a long block. Oil/cambelt/water pump/ inlet/exhaust manifold etc are all items you bolt to the long block -So needed but not supplied with. That said-to be honest your focus is on the wrong part of the bill. --a cambelt itself is only at worst $200.
ralphdog1,
Feb 5, 12:25pm
We will all be very interested in the outcome, I genuinely wish you good luck and please report back!
m16d,
Feb 5, 1:13pm
Crikey. they've offered you a complete new motor. why quibble about the cost of a cam belt that is probably only a hundred bucks or so.
kazbanz,
Feb 5, 1:18pm
MY thinking was sort of along those lines.--except take the offer and the vehicle to someone like german automotive
ianab,
Feb 5, 1:33pm
Crankshafts shouldn't snap. I've never seen a broken one anyway. I've seen broken rods, pistons, cams and almost every other part of the engine. But cranks are supposed to be the strongest bit in the engine.
That suggests it's a manufacturing defect, and so the CGA kicks in. The dealer would not know there was a defect as it's not obvious there was some flaw in the metal, until it breaks, But that's not what the law says. It has to be "free of defects", not just "looked to be OK". The defect was there (probably from factory), and the manufacturer agreeing to supply the main parts suggests they agree.
It's kinda bad luck for the dealer, but under the CGA they are likely on the hook. If the manufacturer hadn't come though, you might have a valid claim for the whole mess. So point that out when you go and negotiate.
Why do car dealers put a mark-up on cars? Because they may have to shell out occasionally in situations like this.
ralphdog1,
Feb 5, 1:36pm
Well in all fairness, he is not quibbling about a $100 cambelt, he's understandably not that keen on shelling out $10k. I'd be thinking really hard about Kaz's advice regarding finding some middle ground, to me that is very sensible.
bjmh,
Feb 5, 1:45pm
Why would Audi even consider the long block,if its out of warranty for age and mileage. unless its a known fault. I sort of agree with kaz. if it was a one owner from the dealer it may be a strong claim. but when you throw in other owners I wouldn't expect the manufacturer to front up 100% .
gooff,
Feb 5, 1:47pm
This is why we felt we had to take it to the DT. We just couldn't roll over and take it, if the DT find that we should pay part of it then that is what we will do, we just feel we have to try. We have offered the dealer other options but they have shut us down hence filing the DT.
poppy62,
Feb 5, 1:50pm
I think the Long block should come with a Cambelt fitted. For the simple reason that it's part of the valve timing mechanism and if the motor (read Crankshaft) was accidentally turned over without a cambelt fitted, then there could be possible damage done. Simply put I'm sure if this was a chain driven cam motor then a Chain would be fitted by the supplier/reconditioner.
sw20,
Feb 5, 1:54pm
By quoting 24 hours at $160+gst an hour + any other ancillaries that need replacing, they will still be turning a profit. They probably got a deal on the long block as it was. Especially if the manufacturer admits there was a fault in manufacture.
sw20,
Feb 5, 1:58pm
Then when you add the price of the vehicle into the mix, I’d say you have a very good case. These are still a $40,000 vehicle. Probably $60k-$70k when you bought it? I’d hazard a guess that it doesn’t meet the acceptable quality for price paid.
differentthings,
Feb 5, 3:27pm
did a quick google search and could not find any common crankshaft breaking faults, but by the looks of things the water pump is driven off the cam belt so it won;t be part of the long block if that's the case. https://www.shopdap.com/blog/post/audi-2-0t-tsi-common-problems.html
kazbanz,
Feb 5, 3:27pm
The MVDT will decide based on one sentence. "for a period of time that is fair and reasonable." THAT is what it will all hinge on. The dealer will argue that 2 years 7 months and 55000km IS a period of time that is fair and reasonable for a used appliance to last. Put simply " At some stage the purchaser had to accept responsibility for the cost of maintaining the vehicle."
There has to come a point in car ownership where its all on the owner. The question will be Has that point in time been reached? Again the concern I have is that the offer currently on the table will be withdrawn pending the MVDT decision --and a ruling against the OP will result in them getting nothing-not even the long block
marte,
Feb 5, 10:50pm
Any 'betterment' is not of the OP's choice. Im quite sure the OP would rather this had not happened in the first place, compaired to what they have gone thru, and will continue to go thru. Knowing that in any minute the crankshaft could snap again.
When it comes down to it, with proper maintenance, that engine will still be going at 500,000 kms. So why should they pay now to have the possibilty of it lasting to 612,000 kms? But then the extra 112,000kms wont make much difference.
The OP should receive something extra as compensation for their loss of time & transport & faith in the brand.
mrfxit,
Feb 6, 2:34am
There are several clear issues here.
#1: The vehicle was s/h with an undisclosed number of previous owners. #2: 2 year warranty but 5 months over, CGA appears to operate at around the 20% overdue mark at max, this is slightly over that % #3: While the manufacture has admitted the fault & supplied a new long block, the vehicle is still well past it's OEM warranty & s/h. #4: Audi's extended warranty will cover for parts and labor up to 10 years or 120,000 miles. #5: 2 sticky points in #4, Did it have the extended warranty & it's now over the km limit. #6: you have owned it for "2 years 5 months", 2 or 3 months over warranty would have been possible but 5 months with all the other factors, is pushing limits pretty hard #7: YES, it will need a new cambelt, It's a NEW LONG BLOCK, it's simply not worth the risk or practical to bed in a s/h cam belt on a new block
intrade,
Feb 6, 2:37am
do you have the numberplate to carjam the engine code?
mrfxit,
Feb 6, 2:39am
Pay up, get your vehicle back & be happy, No, it's not ideal but it "should" be good for a fair few kms now & if you keep ALL docs, receipts etc safe, if it fails again in the next year, then the manufacture could possibly be in the poo again for another block, could take a bit of pushing but there are ways to push that stuff uphill.
Another point, the new block should have it's own warranty & would be covered by NZ CGA anyway. The other thing is the dealers own workmanship warranty that could be of help later on, but by upsetting him, you could be making it a lot harder for any "easy" future help
mrfxit,
Feb 6, 2:40am
Irrelevant to the issue but could be interesting for s/h pricing of current stock
headcat,
Feb 6, 3:22am
In that case how can you expect the dealers inspection to cover the crankshaft. The cam belt and ancillary stuff is just maintenance and should be done by you. you could do it later at a much higher cost when the engine is in the car. My heart bleeds for you.
bill-robinson,
Feb 6, 4:06am
if the engine in quesion had a chain drive cam would it come with a chain fitted? if it was a gear driven cam would the gears be fitted? should come with belt fitted and cam timed. end of problem
electromic,
Feb 6, 4:06am
Part of me thinks that the "new" long block should have a belt fitted. I would have a new belt/water pump/and anything else that needs doing fitted while the engine is out because it will be easier and cheaper. Who pays. Long block supplied by Audi for free. All other parts paid by the owner. Labour to fit engine paid by the owner but if the dealer offered a reduced labour cost, I would take it and be grateful. They are giving the OP a brand new engine. I would love a brand new engine.
curlcrown,
Feb 6, 4:46am
If you go to the tribunal they will consider what is fair and reasonable. They will consider whether a reasonable person would expect the dealer to pay for the repair on a used vehicle after well over two years of ownership and more than 50000km. To me it seems the dealer is being more than fair to you by offering to pay for the parts. They could argue that they owe you nothing and the tribunal could very well agree. They are offering to buy you a new long block so the engine will be better than what you bought in the first place. You should take their offer in my opinion. You may end up with nothing if you go to the tribunal and maybe rightly so. Please let us know the outcome.
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