As Jazz will point out. This would not happen with VW Strangely I agree.
thejazzpianoma,
Jan 4, 9:44am
At the risk of stirring the pot further, yes that is what I would say. I think the majority of Toyota's problems of the last decade have come down to one thing.
A failure to spend enough time and money on R and D.
Its not entirely Toyota's fault, Japan when into recession in the 90's and they had to pinch penny's to survive when the likes of VW had money to burn and spent (if I recall correctly) a quarter of a trillion NZD (equivilent) developing the new range of vehicles that included the MK5 Golf.
Then of course Toyota and friends had to try and catch up in a hurry (not just to VW but everyone else) and its not ended well.
Interestingly though, their customers are so loyal/stubborn its does not seem to have harmed their brand very much.
thejazzpianoma,
Jan 4, 9:44am
At the risk of stirring the pot further, yes that is what I would say. I think the majority of Toyota's problems of the last decade have come down to one thing.
A failure to spend enough time and money on R and D.
Its not entirely Toyota's fault, Japan when into recession in the 90's and they had to pinch penny's to survive when the likes of VW had money to burn and spent (if I recall correctly) a quarter of a trillion NZD (equivilent) developing the new range of vehicles that included the MK5 Golf.
Then of course Toyota and friends had to try and catch up in a hurry (not just to VW but everyone else) and its not ended well.
Interestingly though, their customers are so loyal/stubborn its does not seem to have harmed their brand very much.
The bit I can't work out though, is where Toyota's traditional Japanese sense of honor has gone! It might seem quaint to us but I didn't think it had died out in the minds of Japanese businessmen of yet. Such a debacle would have come close to having some commit seppuku not so very long ago.
pickles26,
Jan 4, 9:51am
not scared to throw money round trying to hide things that affect their name. Its tainted my view of them not that i was much of a supporter previously
thejazzpianoma,
Jan 4, 10:11am
Yes, its a shame as that is "dead money" that doesn't do anything to improve the product. Believe it or not, I was once quite a Toyota fan, I was particularly impressed with the E90 and E100 Corolla's back in the day's of NZ assembly. Now though, they are just a "smoke and mirrors" company. They trade on their once good name and just produce grossly out dated, horribly over priced, badly designed rubbish. The irony is people pay the big money and accept the outdated designs thinking they are getting supreme reliability in return, yet in reality, with many Toyota models you are now getting quite the opposite.
chook90,
Jan 4, 9:56pm
Well having just experienced the dubious honour of 2900kms in a 2010 Corolla I can only wonder what on earth would cause someone to buy one in the first place. I have never driven anything with so little personality and a complete lack of redeeming features. Economy was 8.1l per 100km - average. Power (manual version) was insufficient for my liking unless you are prepared to rev the thing to death - average. Handling was like rowing a dinghy in a 3 meter swell - average. This leaves me wondering how on earth one of the biggest selling cars in our country has achieved it.
I can only conclude that the bulk of product from Japanese manufacturers has been designed to excell at being "average".
pickles26,
Jan 4, 10:07pm
a corolla is an average car always has been always will be. There are other models if you want better than average. However Toyota has gotten cheap and plasticyover the years look at the flimsy interior of the hilux sr5 with door panels that feel like they are going to brake when you lean on them and the clip together plastic dash and basic cloth seats
cassina1,
Jan 4, 11:04pm
They have a small motor and for small motors to be powerful they must be turbocharged. I bought a 2002 RAV 4 2litre and I note to buy a car with the same size motor today (non turbo) the power output is just the same so engine technology has not improved since although emissions are lower on motors made today but I would rather the technology was put into power improvement than emission improvement. Its too bad the price gap going to anything 3litre+ can be $20k+ for brand new.
lazzo,
Jan 4, 11:06pm
This is the most sensible thing I've heard you say for a long time! Thank you.
trade4us2,
Jan 5, 1:51am
I've owned lots of makes of cars:- Hillman, Morris, VW, Holden, Ford Falcon, Fiats, Triumph, Nissan, Daimlers,Chev, Jaguar, Mazda. The Fiats and Mazda and Chev were the most reliable. I'd buy them again. Having got over the need for enormous power (for boat towing) and luxury, I'd now go for reliability and safety.If a Toyota was reliable and safe I'd buy one, but I think they are neither.
austingtir,
Jan 5, 4:16am
Two things i noted in that article the vehicle had completed 280,000 MILES and had been rear ended!
The fact that Toyota actively has tried to cover it all up is unacceptable though.I would like to know exactly what caused the fault to happen as i cant see any info on that yet.
The way some people are carrying on in this thread you'd think their favourite manufacturer had never had a recall.Toyota has gone down hill like a lot of Japanese and other manufacturers but they are still one of the top manufacturers in the world.
I have no intrest in ever owning a toyota either TBH but im not going to listen to a load of Toyota bashing VW idiots on here.
I will also add if you lot cant see this is pretty much driven by politics in the USA then i cant add anything further.
wrong2,
Jan 5, 4:23am
lol hardly
how "powerfull" something is will depend on the viewpoint of the observer
i have a 1300cc civic from the nineties that goes hard - its in a light vehicle & punts the light car along just fine
sure its nowhere near as powerfull as my V8 - but that would be to compare apples & oranges
i do an insane amount of passing in my "non-turbo" & take on gaps that people insupposedly "grunty" cars are too fearfull to take
i can only put it down to fear, (or uselessness), because their cars have more power than i do
franc123,
Jan 5, 5:53am
Maybe when Mitsubishi got busted in the late 90's with hidden cupboardloads of customer complaints documents it became acceptable!
leechie,
Jan 5, 6:06am
When I worked for toyota we had all sorts of problems with the cars, especially the hilux. Theyre complete junk these days sadly. People think Kia are crap cars but compared to toyota, theyre just pounding them for R&D and end product. A mechanic mate of mine who shifted to Kia before me, told me that at a toyota mechanics conference the speaker showed a graph which had market share in NZ. Toyota was ahead by a lot, but the Koreans (Hyundai Etc) were there on the boards. The speaker said, "The Korean brands are making good cars and are starting to eat into our share, but we dont really care about that yet". Just an example of the forward thinking the upper managers at toyota possess.
franc123,
Jan 5, 6:13am
Yes, having looked at last years sales figures they are still well ahead, Corolla outsells the next top selling car by 2 to 1, and still amazingly strong with Hiace and Hilux. the public are clearly still under the spell. The question is really when complacency will start to bite them in the butt, Holden were in a similar situation in Australia in the 60's, had a market share that was untouchable, over 50% at one point until people realised that the opposition were giving them more for their money and were more responsive to their wants and needs.
countrypete,
Jan 5, 6:26am
75% of all Corollas sold new in NZ last year were sold to fleets or rental companies.They buy them because they have a big discount up front, low maintenance costs (proven, not imaginary) and strong resale.Put simply, they have a lower whole-of-life cost than the alternatives.Fleet managers deal with facts, not emotions.This is not to say the car itself is any better than some of the alternatives, but the Corolla does the job, with few shortcomings.
shorebee,
Jan 5, 6:27am
having just brought a focus diesel for same money as new coroola the ford wins hands down for technology and performance and my prior 3 cars were legend awd 3.5 v6, aurion and ford g6e, focus will keep up with them all for half the running costs though g6e was pretty damn good
chook90,
Jan 5, 10:02am
Agreed. Fleet managers are coerced by substantial discounting into purchasing "average" cars - the Corolla as just one example. As a result these savings are able to be offered to leasees, many of whom are entirely price driven. This of course means nothing useful to the private buyer.
As a private buyer I would not touch a new or near new Toyota with a barge pole as I am simply not interested in driving an "average" car in every respect.
gunhand,
Jan 5, 10:03am
What you currently drive!
chook90,
Jan 5, 11:11am
XR6 turbo as a daily, 2011 Focus for a work car.
pickles26,
Jan 5, 6:58pm
Somewhere in that article it says NASA scientists looked into it and found wire hairs inside the throttle position sensor on later model cars it is the accelerator and should be called the app sensor
trade4us2,
Jan 6, 6:44am
In one of the above articles for an electric car it says that when the computer thinks the battery is flat it speeds up the engine so that the battery can be charged. Well, I think that is completely crazy and dangerous. Do I have to spell it out that if the car is in gear and the engine speeds up, the car will go faster than the driver intends.
pickles26,
Jan 6, 11:44pm
there is no mechanical connection between the motor and the wheels on toyota hybrid. So one would assumethis is only to enable the battery to charge faster.
smac,
Jan 7, 12:24am
Ya speeding up the engine and the car are two different things.
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