Can the dealer opt out ?

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martin11, Sep 12, 7:52am
Is he actually a LMVD ? or just a person dealing a lot privately

nice_lady, Sep 12, 8:19am
I'd say that no dealer has to give a warranty on a 2nd hand bike. However the CGA might be a different story - BUT that also depends somewhat on the value of the purchase and as it's passed reserve at $255 I have a feeling you would'nt be able to expect too much from the CGA in this case.

the-lada-dude, Sep 12, 8:33am
Trade in special, . go to his other listings . I would assume with the # of bikes etc on sale. he would have to be a LICENCED dealer ?

kazbanz, Sep 12, 9:04am
the dealer can SAY whatever he wants to. But he can't opt out of his legal obligations.
he has gone into that in between area. The way he can do what he is doing is by describing the faults -but he isn't
HMMM--ANOTHER tard me screw up- when you look at his listings as a group they all show the word Dealer -yet as an individual that word goes .

the-lada-dude, Sep 12, 10:49am
yeah right, that's a TZ 250 in sheep's clothing

the-lada-dude, Sep 12, 10:56am
Thanks, . so when is a trader not a trader in anything ? I don't think he has to be licenced to evade the CGA. . i'm not really after this fellas guts, probably the bike IS a can of worms, but doesn't matter how he describes the bike, is he still liable

kazbanz, Sep 12, 12:01pm
Ok first of all-TM has a glitch. This company is clearly saying they are a dealer when you look at all their adverts. But for some reason this individual advert when you click on it the ( DEALER ) icon goes bye byes.
Now the cga is pretty clear cut about the description bit.
So for example if a dealer advertises a vehicle for sale saying.
"engine overheats" or "clutch slips" or "paint clear coat is peeling on the bonnet" then you can't go back and claim the stated fault or faults under the cga. Well I guess you could but you wouldn't get anywhere.

supernova2, Sep 12, 12:29pm
I'd hate to be a dealer.
What happens if I were to buy something (hell lets be a real pain - its a Rover TomCat) with a noted fault of "clutch slips" then when I pull it to bits to replace the clutch disk ('cause I'm a mean B and don't want to replace the complete kit) and discover the rear main seal is toast and that means a whole lot of xtra work and parts made of unobtainium.
Could I go back to the dealer and claim it has an undisclosed fault and therefore CGA kicks in?

bitsy_boffin, Sep 12, 12:37pm
Implying that the sale is "no warranty" can be regarded an attempt to mislead the public about their rights under the CGA (people will mistake lack of warranty for lack of CGA coverage) and is therefore a violation of the Fair Trading Act.

mrfxit, Sep 12, 1:17pm
Ouch, but possibly if there is other obvious indicators, such as oil leaks/ knocking noises in that area but suspect it would be limited to buying it back & not repair, for being uneconomic

tgray, Sep 12, 3:23pm
I think he meant to say "the dealer can say whatever he wants to, if he can get away with it."

tgray, Sep 12, 3:26pm
As a dealer, for the first time ever, I am about to legally opt out of the CGA. Selling a $1000 car, as an "end of life vehicle and suitable for parts only".
Will see how it goes.

kazbanz, Sep 12, 3:31pm
mate you are quoting me out of context or taking what Im saying the exact opposite of my meaning. --
The dealer can SAY whatever they want to. This is truth in the same way as anyone in NZ can say what they want to.
But the law is the law and those words have no meaning at MVDT --well actually they do -they annoy the adudicators no end because they are trying to deceive the buyers.

headcat, Sep 12, 4:34pm
There are just some people that should not go anywhere near any machinery especially if they cannot read. The guy is telling you that the buyer needs to beware.

sw20, Sep 12, 4:56pm
So it has no WOF and is deregistered?

kazbanz, Sep 12, 5:09pm
You're missing the point--you can't legally do that.

bitsy_boffin, Sep 12, 5:15pm
I think that I understand what you are getting at, that physically they can, of course, "say what they want".

However there are serious consequences for "saying what they want" in this case, which if the powers that be would actually enforce it are far beyond "those statements having no meaning".

Specifically and potentially, the legislation provides fines for such a violation (as making those statements in contravention of Part 1 (section 13).

* in the case of an individual, to a fine not exceeding $200,000; and
* in the case of a body corporate, to a fine not exceeding $600,000.

kazbanz, Sep 12, 5:19pm
Bitzi- that's exactly what I'm getting at.
Doesn't stop them doing it.

tony9, Sep 12, 5:20pm
You are not opting out by advertising it as such. As I am sure you know, someone in Trade cannot opt out of the CGA. But they can sell to someone else in Tradse and then the CGA will not apply. But the Sale of Goods Act will, and it actually sets the same standard as the CGA.

What you are doing is to trying correctly advertise the vehicle so that a reasonable person would consider it to be stuffed. However if I bought it because I wanted a good motor as a part, and found it was stuffed, then CGA would help me get my money back.

tony9, Sep 12, 5:22pm
Actually the dealer cannot say whatever they like. It is a breach of the Fair Trading Act for anyone to attempt to mislead a buyer with the intention of avoiding the CGA.

tgray, Sep 12, 7:19pm
Your not a good reader, are you.

tgray, Sep 12, 7:20pm
It IS legal for a dealer to opt out of the CGA providing the car is advertised correctly as suitable for purpose or sold for commercial use.

kazbanz, Sep 12, 7:34pm
Gosh tony--please read the whole post again.
I CAN say you owe me a million dollars NOW.--Look I just said it. !
Is it legally binding or enforceable--Nope. Is it line with NZ law NOPE--but I still said it.
see my point?

tony9, Sep 12, 8:00pm
Yes, I read this. http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1986/0121/latest/DLM96902.html?search=sw_096be8ed815969ba_mislead_25_se&p=1&sr=1

I guess a dealer can say something misleading, but the law forbids it.

Same as someone can commit murder.

tony9, Sep 12, 8:14pm
A Dealer selling to someone not in trade can make it hard if not impossible to be liable under the CGA, with appropriate advertising, but they cannot opt out.

http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1993/0091/latest/DLM312859.html?search=sw_096be8ed814da84a_opt+out_25_se&p=1

However under the Fair Trading Act a commercial trader can successfully take action against another dealer for pretty much all the CGA covers, the process is not as easy though.