Because you are misleading customers who might not know better, same reason its illegal
networkguy,
Jul 26, 4:05am
I think your running out of arguments so you just try to twist mine to suit you. I wouldn't expect the dealer to look at it for free, but once it became apparent that it was a fault and not wear and tear I expect them to do the right thing without making me go to dispute tribunal, ESPECIALLY if its an easy fix. I think its quite obvious that you will fight the consumer at every turn. A decent salesman would at least take the evidence into consideration, not simply say no because of the age as you are still suggesting.
tigertim20,
Jul 26, 6:07am
8 years. you are dreaming. /thread IMO.
tgray,
Jul 26, 8:02pm
Well the law comes down to what's fair and reasonable for both parties, and that's obviously subjective as this thread has shown. I go out of my way many a time over and beyond my legal responsibilities to help my customers, but I think you are the one being unreasonable in this instance. The law takes into account the time frame involved and I have never read a Tribunal decision ruling in favour of the complainant that concerned a fault 8 years prior. I will leave it at that.
a.woodrow,
Jul 26, 9:22pm
How is it a fault and not wear and tear if it has lasted 8 years trouble free?
strobo,
Jul 26, 10:24pm
If its got tits or wheels its gonna give ya trouble either way !
networkguy,
Jul 27, 5:07am
It depends on the issue. A tyre tread wearing out after 8 years is fair enough. The issue with my brakes was wiring wearing out, this didn't happen to mine but must have happened to some vehicles and they deemed it shouldn't have happened, so they replaced all of them for free to a version with better shielding around the wiring. Last year GM recalled all Malibus from 1997-2005 because the ignitions had worn out and started turning off while people were driving, especially if they had heavy keyrings attached. I personally would have thought a 17 year old ignition would not be recalled, but I guess because of the seriousness of the issue some people disagreed. This proves my point though, you can't just dismiss an issue because of the age, and I have given several examples of this while tgray has given precisely none, just keeps saying he knows of dispute tribunal decisions!
tgray,
Jul 27, 6:39am
Ok, I said I wouldn't post anymore, but it seems I need to repeat myself. There is a difference between manufacturer recalls (which I agree should occur whether it's 8 years or more) and CGA claims against the individual retailer. You dismissed this earlier, but I think it is very relevant. An airbag light coming on many years later, does not mean you automatically hold the seller liable under the CGA and expect a free repair. I have sold thousands of cars and luckily never met someone like yourself who seem to think you have an unlimited extended free warranty. Don't get me wrong, I see your point and agree with you - Just not your time frame. 8 years later? In some countries, cars that are 10 years old are considered 'end of life' cars. Luckily the law protects sellers against unreasonable claims against sellers. I am not a naive individual, and most people know what is reasonable, even if the law does not define it, and I say again, a CGA claim against some alleged faulty wiring 8 years after purchase would not prevail in a Disputes tribunal hearing as it would be almost impossible to prove it was faulty at the time of sale. For the record, I have read a lot of tribunal results, so am not necessarily speaking from my own point of view entirely, but from what I have gathered from actual findings. OK, say what you like now, as I truly am done here.
supernova2,
Jul 27, 9:32am
I think that a fault with wiring wearing out is a bit of an unusual situation. Given that airbag wires are passive items in a car I find it hard to see how the problem that the OP alludes to can be anything other than a manufacturing fault. After all a wiring harness can hardly be considered a consumable item which would be replaced at regular intervals. Obviously the age of the vehicle is a factor as AFAIK the fault is not apparent in new vehicles but when they get a bit of age on them. One of the problems with some formulations of copper wire is that it will work harden and break if its subject to vibration etc. Given the millions of cars out there with airbag systems if a particular model has problems with wires/plugs etc and the vast majority of other models don't have those problems then surely the model with the problem must be a manufacturing defect. Now the clockspring is different as that's a part that moves every time the steering wheel is turned. So logically a broken clockspring is a wear and tear item or should it be that the makers should have designed a better system?
Look at it this way. How many cars have to have the wires to the left tail light replaced? I'd say almost none. How many cars have to have the airbag harness replaced. From the sounds of it lots (on a world scale) for no reason apart from the fact that the harness falls to bits. To my mind its the frequency of the problem that helps to indicate its a manufacturing/design fault that should be repaired under the CGA.
I think with the right research and a well reasoned case the OP would/should succeed in the DT.
jgoater,
Jul 27, 8:39pm
There may well be a case to be made against the manufacturer after 8 years, but not against the retailer.
lespat,
Jul 28, 5:46am
This is a classic example of many Kiwis, "It's always someone elses fault" syndrome! And they must pay. Completely unreasonable to expect recompense 8 years down the track.
gunhand,
Jul 28, 7:38am
Sooooo (just cause I'm bored) If say being a self made man with to much money and garage space I was to purchase the very latest HSGTRVBOSSSENATORSSEVO20WRX (only 100 ever made) and decided to only use it on very fine Sundays only. Now I only do 100kph a month if that. Keep it well maintained and oils and other fluids changed etc etc. Even start it regularly to keep oil up as well. Now after 8 years it will have 9600kms if that as its not always fine on Sundays. I really want to keep the KMs down on this limited edition beast to keep it of value. BUT, one Sunday I do get brave and go on a 200km run and the very HiPo motors craps itself all over the road. Thats fine my chopper will come fetch me. I do some research and find that 50 out of the 100 did the same thing around 10000kms. They were all covered under warranty as there owners drove them daily (fools). Sooooo, what about me? Covered by anything? Factory? CGA? Dealer? Now being as rich as I am I am also a recluse and never heard about or got any notification about the fault that will cause this hemorrhage. Could happen ya know. And NO I'm not bloody paying for it myself even though I could by the Factory twice over.
3tomany,
Jul 28, 7:51am
Wow what an amazing thread 8 years is almost end of life. Just because the problem may be common for the vehicle does not mean it is not simply a wear and tear item, at 8 years I would say suck it up and pay for the repair.
jason_247,
Jul 28, 11:09am
doesnt really matter about milage as nothing is wearing the wires down as you move.
at 8 years old they car has gone through nearly 3000 heat cycles with the day and night temps alone. this all works against wiring.
And you contradict yourself in the first post.
a single mechanic has said "yea ive had to fix this issue a few times" yet you then say its not a common thing to fail? is he really lucky to have the same problem presented to him or is this actually a case of its a common fault so would then be normal wear and tear?
jason_247,
Jul 28, 11:20am
the door hinges on my parents house have lasted 40 years. but im sure if i slammed my front door every day for 5 years it will wear out. is this unreasonable? not really.
Kms are really useless. if i live in auckland and drive at 100kph for 10ks on the smooth motorway nothing will wear/. If i do 10kms on a rough forestry track things will be pushed much harder.
So what do you expect to fail first the fairmont with 400000kms of road driving or the triton with 100000kms of gravel roads and paddock bashing?
the mitsi would obviously die first.
networkguy,
Jul 29, 9:51am
This guy gets it lol. The maths isn't hard, and the only argument people have against this is to twist my words and claim I want everything fixed for free. I haven't said that, I have said that if a part has a fault, and there is evidence that this is happening to a large number of that particular model, you are not wrong to want it fixed. Regardless of age. And I have provided evidence to show that this is indeed how it works, while people like tgray have provided only hearsay. Many other factors come into play yes, such as the seriousness of the fault (a minor part wearing out is not comparable to airbags that can kill you). Does this sound like I want everything fixed for free? Quit twisting my words tgray, thats the only way you can argue against this lol
skiff1,
Jul 29, 10:05am
I bought a lollipop last week. Bloody thing looks like a tooth pick now! I'm gonna take the bloke from the dairy to the disputes tribunal, it's a well known fault. He should replace it, and God help him if the replacement one doesn't last longer.
darryl,
Jul 29, 11:36am
I bought a lotto ticket with the express purpose of winning lots of money. It didnt happen - so obviously it wasnt fit for purpose.
waahhhh wahhhhh
networkguy,
Jul 29, 8:52pm
Hmm I guess theres only idiots here. A Lollipop being eaten is clearly not a fault, and a lotto ticket not winning isn't either. If the lollipops were a pack of 20 and I ate 5 and on the 6th one I discovered a foreign object, I would expect to be able to get a full refund anyway, and thats the way it works. In reality, I would probably let the company know and not care about a refund of a few dollars. And as for the lotto ticket, if you bought a lucky dip and later discovered a bug in the random number generator caused a large number (percentage) of people to get the exact same numbers as you, or the lotto draw was found to be rigged, that would be an example of a fault. Are you guys even capable of rational thinking? If you are going to respond claiming I am wrong, can you back it up with some actual facts like I have done? Are you all second hand car dealers by chance?
tintop,
Jul 29, 10:46pm
You best read up the CGA process.
The first action to take under the CGA is to discuss with the supplier.
elect70,
Jul 30, 2:16am
Isnt wiring made biodegradeable these days , so guess its half way there ? Nothing in cars is made to last more than 10 years otherwise they wouldnt sell new ones if we all kept them for decades .
skiff1,
Jul 30, 7:26am
google the following terms. Farce, sarcasm, hyperbole.
3tomany,
Jul 30, 8:00am
DB should be sued to I bought a box of export expecting it to last longer than a day Grrrrrr
tgray,
Jul 30, 9:05am
Gee, say you bought a car and 8 years later the airbag light comes on. Sounds like the dealer in 2007 ripped you off aye? Better litigate.
networkguy,
Jul 30, 9:12am
Your argument is based on trying to make it seem like I'm saying something which I'm not.
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